pop-global-mark and info buffers

pop-global-mark and info buffers

[T.V Raman]

Suspect this is how it's been for a long time, but it breaks somewhat
unnecessarily, see below.

You're reding something in the info manual, and you set the mark.
2. You move on, do other things in other buffers.
   3. You invoke pop-global-mark (C-x C-SPC) and as you cycle through,
      hit the mark in the info buffer.

      If you happen to have changed nodes in the info buffer after you
      set the mark earlier, you get this error message --- which is
      annoying:

      Global mark position is outside accessible part of buffer 

-- 

Thanks,

--Raman
♉ Id: kg:/m/0285kf1  🦮

-- 

Thanks,

--Raman
♉ Id: kg:/m/0285kf1  🦮

Re: pop-global-mark and info buffers

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: "T.V Raman" <raman@google.com>
> Date: Sat,  5 Dec 2020 19:35:17 -0800 (PST)
> 
>    3. You invoke pop-global-mark (C-x C-SPC) and as you cycle through,
>       hit the mark in the info buffer.
> 
>       If you happen to have changed nodes in the info buffer after you
>       set the mark earlier, you get this error message --- which is
>       annoying:
> 
>       Global mark position is outside accessible part of buffer 

What would you like to happen instead? the message is factually
correct.

Re: pop-global-mark and info buffers

[T.V Raman]

The message may be factually correct but useless. It could in the
least tell you the buffer where the mark is "out of reach"Eli Zaretskii writes:
 > > From: "T.V Raman" <raman@google.com>
 > > Date: Sat,  5 Dec 2020 19:35:17 -0800 (PST)
 > > 
 > >    3. You invoke pop-global-mark (C-x C-SPC) and as you cycle through,
 > >       hit the mark in the info buffer.
 > > 
 > >       If you happen to have changed nodes in the info buffer after you
 > >       set the mark earlier, you get this error message --- which is
 > >       annoying:
 > > 
 > >       Global mark position is outside accessible part of buffer 
 > 
 > What would you like to happen instead? the message is factually
 > correct.

-- 
♉Id: kg:/m/0285kf1  🦮♉

--
♉Id: kg:/m/0285kf1  🦮♉

Arch linux patches

[Ergus]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 359 bytes --]

Hi:
Recently checking the PKGCONFIG for emacs in arch linux 
https://github.com/archlinux/svntogit-packages/tree/packages/emacs/trunk

I see that they needed to add 3 patches to emacs 27 to avoid some issues.
I am wondering if this fixes 

1. are needed in general2. if (1.) are these changes or equivalent already in the emacs 27 branch?
Best,Ergus

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 634 bytes --]

Re: Arch linux patches

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date: Sun, 6 Dec 2020 15:42:46 +0000 (UTC)
> From: Ergus <spacibba@aol.com>
> 
> Recently checking the PKGCONFIG for emacs in arch linux 
> 
> https://github.com/archlinux/svntogit-packages/tree/packages/emacs/trunk
> 
> I see that they needed to add 3 patches to emacs 27 to avoid some issues.
> 
> I am wondering if this fixes 
> 
> 1. are needed in general
> 2. if (1.) are these changes or equivalent already in the emacs 27 branch?

They are already in Emacs 27.

Re: pop-global-mark and info buffers

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: "T.V Raman" <raman@google.com>
> Date: Sun, 6 Dec 2020 06:57:48 -0800
> Cc: raman@google.com,
>     emacs-devel@gnu.org
> 
> The message may be factually correct but useless. It could in the
> least tell you the buffer where the mark is "out of reach"

Thanks, I added the buffer name to the error message for Emacs 28.

Re: pop-global-mark and info buffers

[T.V Raman]

thx, that is a useful fix Eli Zaretskii writes:
 > > From: "T.V Raman" <raman@google.com>
 > > Date: Sun, 6 Dec 2020 06:57:48 -0800
 > > Cc: raman@google.com,
 > >     emacs-devel@gnu.org
 > > 
 > > The message may be factually correct but useless. It could in the
 > > least tell you the buffer where the mark is "out of reach"
 > 
 > Thanks, I added the buffer name to the error message for Emacs 28.

-- 
♉Id: kg:/m/0285kf1  🦮♉

--
♉Id: kg:/m/0285kf1  🦮♉

Re: pop-global-mark and info buffers

[T.V Raman]

[-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --]
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain; charset=gb18030, Size: 1416 bytes --]

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:

Thinking more about this:

1.As a long time Emacs user, I suspect I almost never set the mark in
info buffers which is likely why I never got bitten by this.

2. The mark ring -- both local and global mark rings are powerful
   features but not very approachable to a new Emacs user, and this
   specific bug likely will drive at least some of them away.

   3. The fix to the error message will help, but it may be possible to
      do more for the user, e.g. if the marker is outside the narrowed
      portion of a buffer, widen and then jump there? We could also
      special case info so that we widen, jump and narrow to the node
      containing the marker.

      4. If we dont do 3, perhaps we could in the least jump to the
         buffer containing the mark, and change the error to a warning
         message that tells the user to widen the visible portion of the
         buffer and then tell him how to jump there after widening 
>> From: "T.V Raman" <raman@google.com>
>> Date: Sun, 6 Dec 2020 06:57:48 -0800
>> Cc: raman@google.com,
>>     emacs-devel@gnu.org
>> 
>> The message may be factually correct but useless. It could in the
>> least tell you the buffer where the mark is "out of reach"
>
> Thanks, I added the buffer name to the error message for Emacs 28.

-- 

Thanks,

--Raman
7©4 Id: kg:/m/0285kf1  •0Ü8

Re: pop-global-mark and info buffers

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: "T.V Raman" <raman@google.com>
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Date: Sun, 06 Dec 2020 12:15:45 -0800
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
> 
> Thinking more about this:
> 
> 1.As a long time Emacs user, I suspect I almost never set the mark in
> info buffers which is likely why I never got bitten by this.
> 
> 2. The mark ring -- both local and global mark rings are powerful
>    features but not very approachable to a new Emacs user, and this
>    specific bug likely will drive at least some of them away.
> 
>    3. The fix to the error message will help, but it may be possible to
>       do more for the user, e.g. if the marker is outside the narrowed
>       portion of a buffer, widen and then jump there? We could also
>       special case info so that we widen, jump and narrow to the node
>       containing the marker.
> 
>       4. If we dont do 3, perhaps we could in the least jump to the
>          buffer containing the mark, and change the error to a warning
>          message that tells the user to widen the visible portion of the
>          buffer and then tell him how to jump there after widening 

There's a variable widen-automatically, did you try to use it?

Re: pop-global-mark and info buffers

[T.V Raman]

I haven't pulled and rebuilt yet :-)Eli Zaretskii writes:
 > > From: "T.V Raman" <raman@google.com>
 > > Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
 > > Date: Sun, 06 Dec 2020 12:15:45 -0800
 > > 
 > > Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
 > > 
 > > Thinking more about this:
 > > 
 > > 1.As a long time Emacs user, I suspect I almost never set the mark in
 > > info buffers which is likely why I never got bitten by this.
 > > 
 > > 2. The mark ring -- both local and global mark rings are powerful
 > >    features but not very approachable to a new Emacs user, and this
 > >    specific bug likely will drive at least some of them away.
 > > 
 > >    3. The fix to the error message will help, but it may be possible to
 > >       do more for the user, e.g. if the marker is outside the narrowed
 > >       portion of a buffer, widen and then jump there? We could also
 > >       special case info so that we widen, jump and narrow to the node
 > >       containing the marker.
 > > 
 > >       4. If we dont do 3, perhaps we could in the least jump to the
 > >          buffer containing the mark, and change the error to a warning
 > >          message that tells the user to widen the visible portion of the
 > >          buffer and then tell him how to jump there after widening 
 > 
 > There's a variable widen-automatically, did you try to use it?

-- 
♉Id: kg:/m/0285kf1  🦮♉

--
♉Id: kg:/m/0285kf1  🦮♉

Re: pop-global-mark and info buffers

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: "T.V Raman" <raman@google.com>
> Date: Sun, 6 Dec 2020 17:17:09 -0800
> Cc: raman@google.com,
>     emacs-devel@gnu.org
> 
> I haven't pulled and rebuilt yet :-)Eli Zaretskii writes:

That variable existed before my changes.

Re: pop-global-mark and info buffers

[T.V Raman]

[-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --]
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain; charset=gb18030, Size: 206 bytes --]

OK,  took a look. That variable exists but things like info dont appear
to leverage it --  I assume you mean this one:

widen-automatically 
-- 

Thanks,

--Raman
7©4 Id: kg:/m/0285kf1  •0Ü8

Re: pop-global-mark and info buffers

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: "T.V Raman" <raman@google.com>
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Date: Mon, 07 Dec 2020 06:52:23 -0800
> 
> OK,  took a look. That variable exists but things like info dont appear
> to leverage it --  I assume you mean this one:
> 
> widen-automatically 

Yes.  But I didn't mean that Info uses it, I meant for you to set it
non-nil, if that's what you want.

Re: pop-global-mark and info buffers

[T.V Raman]

[-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --]
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain; charset=gb18030, Size: 508 bytes --]

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:


it's default is t.>> From: "T.V Raman" <raman@google.com>
>> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
>> Date: Mon, 07 Dec 2020 06:52:23 -0800
>> 
>> OK,  took a look. That variable exists but things like info dont appear
>> to leverage it --  I assume you mean this one:
>> 
>> widen-automatically 
>
> Yes.  But I didn't mean that Info uses it, I meant for you to set it
> non-nil, if that's what you want.

-- 

Thanks,

--Raman
7©4 Id: kg:/m/0285kf1  •0Ü8

RE: pop-global-mark and info buffers

[Drew Adams]

>    1. You're reading something in the info manual, and you set the mark.
>    2. You move on, do other things in other buffers.
>    3. You invoke pop-global-mark (C-x C-SPC) and as you cycle through,
>       hit the mark in the info buffer.
> 
>       If you happen to have changed nodes in the info buffer after you
>       set the mark earlier, you get this error message --- which is
>       annoying:
> 
>       Global mark position is outside accessible part of buffer

Yes, an Info node is a buffer restriction (a "narrowing").  The full buffer contains the whole manual.  If you try to go to a marker (buffer position) that's outside the current restriction (node) then you get that error.

For navigating among places you set in Info (same manual or not), you can do either of these things:

1. Bookmark the places you want to come back to.
2. Use `L' to get a menu/index/TOC of your visited nodes.

Bookmarks are generally what you want, I expect.
___


If you use Bookmark+ you can use `bmkp-info-auto-bookmark-mode' to turn on/off _automatic_ Info bookmarking.  That creates a bookmark for each node you visit, with the node name as the bookmark name.

An option makes the node optionally only update, not create, such bookmarks.  You can toggle the option between `create-or-replace' and `update-only' with command `bmkp-toggle-info-auto-type'.  (When you visit a bookmark it is updated, which increases the visit count and the last visited time.)

https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/BookmarkPlus#AutomaticInfoBookmarking

(If you use Bookmark+ then bookmarks can also be temporary.  Even without Bookmark+ you can just delete or not save bookmarks you create, if you don't want to persist them.)