From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: What is GNU ELPA? Date: Sat, 16 May 2020 17:43:14 +0300 Message-ID: <83k11cc54t.fsf@gnu.org> References: <35DBF02E-44D7-41E5-A217-7D6EC84ED221@icloud.com> <07d7ff5d-dd57-00e7-933f-3188d57d6185@yandex.ru> <96f718b4-8ba9-7b9a-f940-7070e4a9a424@yandex.ru> <83sgg13cek.fsf@gnu.org> <096d8f50-3568-8f01-610f-65199c583358@yandex.ru> <83lflt1flx.fsf@gnu.org> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="125843"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: rms@gnu.org, joostkremers@fastmail.fm, Emacs-devel@gnu.org, ams@gnu.org, pcr910303@icloud.com, dgutov@yandex.ru, phillip.lord@russet.org.uk To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat May 16 16:44:07 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jZy2o-000WbY-L6 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 16 May 2020 16:44:06 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55238 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jZy2n-0005TU-NU for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 16 May 2020 10:44:05 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:60388) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jZy2J-00053I-Fc for Emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 16 May 2020 10:43:35 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:42716) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jZy2I-0008OL-Uf; Sat, 16 May 2020 10:43:34 -0400 Original-Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=3210 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1jZy29-0005Mv-C7; Sat, 16 May 2020 10:43:25 -0400 In-Reply-To: (message from Stefan Monnier on Sat, 16 May 2020 08:48:55 -0400) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:250498 Archived-At: > From: Stefan Monnier > Cc: Eli Zaretskii , dgutov@yandex.ru, > joostkremers@fastmail.fm, ams@gnu.org, Emacs-devel@gnu.org, > pcr910303@icloud.com, phillip.lord@russet.org.uk > Date: Sat, 16 May 2020 08:48:55 -0400 > > > As I understand it, space is the only reason that we don't > > put all those packages in the core. > > AFAIK space was definitely not the motivation It says "space etc.", so not just space. > The reasons were rather to: > - Decouple those packages from Emacs's release cycle. That'd fall under the "etc." part in my book, because the package still logically is part of Emacs, just being released separately. > - Avoid the never ending problems with packages that are in emacs.git > but whose "upstream" is elsewhere, where the two code bases require > extra efforts to keep them in sync (enough efforts that sometimes this > sync is lost, as is the case for CEDET IIRC). For that, we could use the same technique as we use in ELPA for "external" packages, could we not? > - More generally give more freedom to the authors (many authors are > *not* interested in having their code in emacs.git because of the > extra constraints that it implies). > > The last two problems *also* affect GNU ELPA, ironically, tho to > a lesser extent. I'm sorry to say, but I feel we are trying to retroactively invent reasons to justify the actual situation and the goals that got shifted from their original. As the description of ELPA shows, the original goal was to have an extension of Emacs that is separate for minor technical reasons.