From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: icon-title-format vs. frame-title-format (Bug#61496) Date: Fri, 05 May 2023 08:33:14 +0300 Message-ID: <83jzxnjqat.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87bkj1ar9n.fsf@yahoo.com> <7e6334ce-c9a3-2c58-d263-fa962f0c2f7d@web.de> <877ctocfpq.fsf@telefonica.net> <87zg6jab1f.fsf@yahoo.com> <87y1m3bnff.fsf@telefonica.net> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="8213"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri May 05 07:32:59 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1puo3v-0001t8-0d for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 05 May 2023 07:32:59 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1puo3c-0000ai-V0; Fri, 05 May 2023 01:32:41 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1puo3Y-0000ZD-6t for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 05 May 2023 01:32:37 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1puo3K-0000PG-4d; Fri, 05 May 2023 01:32:35 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=z/hoSIBGJM27bJA2X2y8u3kiO0cwgf63ziGr5WhSDT0=; b=VueE+3Gdltk0 HX+CQQ/OETGJLLqaVp4TtUsO0Do49IDJYpOLl8/3TGDqNc+wnSeN2JoeKu1VOfvFzhTi5kAexwj5s sYaPxPbP6hhEDILi5YSoICveoQ7sC5c3W4Qvep48hUyzRPHCKZRfK3kZoHlU1Un8oUbeErYTO7xcP MOmEns6S85EnpGGKP4bdpSqT5Up1ZFp/lNhlc6iyKr9vbNsWSTPNn/ezN7PLjhV3wb1ikR3yQQomA 0lfh29arUL+h/3DI6Wr8OLJoTRAsRYZZlWp1F3POrV75n7PZIJqrweUbXZCM5LWOh9vZBdzfPqh/k hit0JTwANVR4yhMy+VUgIw==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1puo3I-0002RI-S1; Fri, 05 May 2023 01:32:21 -0400 In-Reply-To: (tomas@tuxteam.de) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:305859 Archived-At: > Date: Fri, 5 May 2023 06:44:45 +0200 > From: > > > > ``minimize'' is not modern terminology. It is simply terminology used > > > by proprietary window systems. > > > > KDE and AwesomeWM (just to mention the window managers I have installed > > on this machine) are not proprietary. AFAIK Gnome also uses "minimize" > > on its user-oriented documentation, so does Xfce and LXQt. > > Po Lu is still right. The question is whether to accept Microsoft's > intellectual hegemony here (as the GNU/Linux desktop ennvironments > have done, too lightly for my personal taste) or not. > > Tough question. I clearly side with Po Lu's standpoint here, but can > understand that there are others. There's no "standpoint" here. Our documentation must be easily interpreted by today's users, and so boycotting terminology we don't like is silly and futile. We will be shooting ourselves in the foot. Once again: the documentation already says that these two are equivalent, so both terms can be used. Which one to use in each case depends on the context; for example, when talking about variables or functions that include "icon" in their names, using "iconify" is clearly better (but "minimize" could be mentioned in parentheses as the alternative, where appropriate).