From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Summary and next steps for (package-initialize) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2017 20:12:11 +0300 Message-ID: <83h8ww99g4.fsf@gnu.org> References: <42c93165-2d85-8501-9cc8-99830b7b3646@gmail.com> <37bdcd8e-2bb4-fd21-d833-838bd26f5e56@gmail.com> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1503594769 31433 195.159.176.226 (24 Aug 2017 17:12:49 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2017 17:12:49 +0000 (UTC) Cc: radon.neon@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Nikolay Kudryavtsev Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Aug 24 19:12:45 2017 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1dkvgN-0007ke-Fu for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 24 Aug 2017 19:12:39 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:49596 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dkvgU-0004gh-9f for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 24 Aug 2017 13:12:46 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:43697) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dkvgN-0004gW-Kz for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 24 Aug 2017 13:12:40 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dkvgJ-0006fD-L7 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 24 Aug 2017 13:12:39 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:42639) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dkvgJ-0006f7-Hd; Thu, 24 Aug 2017 13:12:35 -0400 Original-Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:4497 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1dkvgH-0005gX-Ct; Thu, 24 Aug 2017 13:12:35 -0400 In-reply-to: (message from Nikolay Kudryavtsev on Wed, 23 Aug 2017 23:09:37 +0300) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:217773 Archived-At: > From: Nikolay Kudryavtsev > Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2017 23:09:37 +0300 > Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org > > The problem with second init is that we're introducing a major user > configuration change to fix some shortcoming in Emacs internals. If the package.el configuration file is used only for stuff that needs to be set before package-initialize is called, then its contents will be minimal, and for many users it doesn't even have to exist, because the use cases to which it caters are quite special (packages that are installed, but the user doesn't want to use them). By contrast, the problem we are solving with this file is a much larger one, and affects many more users.