From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Lisp files that load cl-lib in problematical ways Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2023 18:21:32 +0300 Message-ID: <83h6mkq9vn.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87il8betof.fsf@dataswamp.org> <83fs3dgxv8.fsf@gnu.org> <835y38qvlg.fsf@gnu.org> <87bkcx6eci.fsf@dataswamp.org> <83ttqnm4ti.fsf@gnu.org> <87r0lqoo5x.fsf@dataswamp.org> <83msweu76j.fsf@gnu.org> <87o7gungi1.fsf@dataswamp.org> <83y1fxss9j.fsf@gnu.org> <64027fc9-0b02-4805-ae4b-4171dc06705f@vodafonemail.de> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="34360"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Jens Schmidt Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Oct 21 17:21:58 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1quDna-0008f7-72 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 21 Oct 2023 17:21:58 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1quDnG-0007ek-AS; Sat, 21 Oct 2023 11:21:38 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1quDnD-0007eL-Qw for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 21 Oct 2023 11:21:35 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1quDnD-0001XP-Io; Sat, 21 Oct 2023 11:21:35 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=oSnfcj6QhHGKyFKPqNq5MxqFCr7/qlQCgjSr9M5fAGE=; b=KRU75zFrYZFv 8eX18iQrk4MsXuHsnoDAVUZsf6zKf8WX6QEFhbA1RjTY1Bfz77yXeXinvTf5Rpu2WHnxbDK6yZEiq ZLMPHwvWJchfujVyOWNLGPoSMenZfCGvzeu9KquBLkMQR6u4aaCPO75vGDdhyQ5MJqWgskX8dIOqb Qk0yJD60zgySRpl5F6JacOpf6toquq2XyjSaE8g+mezk1M3h6zT9QM1X+SoBIrvtYe2z5WDPlJPO9 /QY1GU5/+Yslkf5loosi62hMFJwplwscD4q+bRqoKSDjJlRSEsmwUApBb2ImJP9nshVqf5uQplGm8 wBeBH36eMeR1V86SPilthg==; In-Reply-To: <64027fc9-0b02-4805-ae4b-4171dc06705f@vodafonemail.de> (message from Jens Schmidt on Sat, 21 Oct 2023 17:17:24 +0200) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:311654 Archived-At: > Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2023 17:17:24 +0200 > Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org > From: Jens Schmidt > > On 2023-10-20 08:49, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > > For Emacs to preload unnecessary stuff is unclean, and we try to avoid > > that uncleanliness. > > I have to admit that I don't fully understand the dump/bootstrap logic > of Emacs (yet), but doesn't inhibit the following test in Frequire already > any/most uncleanliness: > > /* This is to make sure that loadup.el gives a clear picture > of what files are preloaded and when. */ > if (will_dump_p () && !will_bootstrap_p ()) > { > /* Avoid landing here recursively while outputting the > backtrace from the error. */ > gflags.will_dump_ = false; > error ("(require %s) while preparing to dump", > SDATA (SYMBOL_NAME (feature))); > } No, because there's more than one way of loading a Lisp package. Moreover, we could have a situation where cl-lib is not preloaded, but just starting "emacs -Q" loads it (e.g., via some autoloaded feature), and that also should be avoided.