From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Make all tree-sitter modes optional Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2023 21:29:01 +0200 Message-ID: <83cz6ccagy.fsf@gnu.org> References: <84973.1672843723@hassadar.pretzelnet.org> <83wn62xi3k.fsf@gnu.org> <83o7rexe2n.fsf@gnu.org> <83h6x5xym7.fsf@gnu.org> <83h6wr6gmz.fsf@gnu.org> <868ri140sr.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <83fsc92gbz.fsf@gnu.org> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="22110"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: juri@linkov.net, casouri@gmail.com, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, larsi@gnus.org, theo@thornhill.no, jostein@secure.kjonigsen.net, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Alan Mackenzie Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Tue Feb 14 20:30:13 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pS10F-0005Ul-Ti for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 14 Feb 2023 20:30:11 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pS0za-0007Kt-It; Tue, 14 Feb 2023 14:29:30 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pS0zX-0007Ka-HZ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 14 Feb 2023 14:29:27 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pS0zV-0006Fd-O3; Tue, 14 Feb 2023 14:29:25 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=yWsjFnEhmf4iLMeYAeil8mCSgWn0fVW2DfZyouLY+zA=; b=hPktZlVixmQS g3a7Y50yDwIswGxInNc5Ad8Ma1CPGIiphnmrmzZiL4LcGJEHyIgeS9y+VoUWp0socgwH2sH/kOUyg LVGIYOElDVCCW/0pOKcLF4kIFdQFohTGg2O9nhavu81sjke75ke4YndRCmopUnhDrXrCy8fF2fHzG tQFVvAsGByQoS5II6dpx8e3AxmIR4wN7wXT71A/3mkTkd8G9Y20ntcHbh9COU5UXMPRnor7AamLfR cr0FDrOKqdBBa+TpKvEcEY8PViW8IWo0S9YafXmianB3bzKIyQpG6hcPaMaqHH+q1lc4jpgh0D7MQ uJg5NJeKRQgybjJHWOzLEw==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pS0zT-0002rK-5g; Tue, 14 Feb 2023 14:29:25 -0500 In-Reply-To: (message from Alan Mackenzie on Tue, 14 Feb 2023 19:08:42 +0000) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:303288 Archived-At: > Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2023 19:08:42 +0000 > Cc: Juri Linkov , casouri@gmail.com, > monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, larsi@gnus.org, theo@thornhill.no, > jostein@secure.kjonigsen.net, emacs-devel@gnu.org > From: Alan Mackenzie > > Hello, Eli. > > I missed this thread back in January, due to being away from Emacs > development for a time, and I think the current state of this feature is > so far away from ideal as to make some design and implementation > advisable. It's too bad you are raising this up only now, because it's too late for any significant changes, even if I were to agree with what you propose. Some things you miss cannot be brought back, sorry. You have to be around and participate in the relevant discussions, let alone be part of implementing the features, to have your opinions taken into considerations when it matters. > No, it is not adequate. It is horrible. Not a very kind remark, to say the least. > How about commands c-make-ts-default-mode and c-make-ts-undefault-mode I'm okay with adding the latter, if it turns out easy enough and safe enough (of which I'm not sure at all), and if such a command will be implemented for all the *-ts-modes which have non-ts siblings, but I see no reason for the former, since there are several simple ways to cause the same effect, and they are all documented in NEWS. Please note, however, that a pretest is hopefully very close, and so there isn't much time for adding such commands. I would say that for that reason your proposal is not practical. > The first of these would push the new entries onto auto-mode-alist > and the second would remove them again. I think you have a very simplistic idea of what loading a *-ts-mode does, but if you can come up with a simple and safe implementation, I won't object adding such a command -- it cannot do any harm by just being there, and if it turns to be not what users want, we can always advise them not to use it. > Or we could have a customisable option, c-default-c-mode which users > could set when they are ready. That was considered, and was found to be either too complicated in practice or, if implemented simply, not to work well enough. So let's not go there. > Either of these would allow the user to try out the new modes freely > without being coerced against their will to use the new -ts- modes. "Try out" is not what I had in mind for users who'd like to use these modes. > > The ones you proposed until now are significantly more complex, and it > > is not reasonable to ask users to go to such lengths to try a new mode. > > Any reasonable solution is going to be more complicated than the current > code. Then they aren't "reasonable" at this time. Maybe later, maybe on master. As I said several times, we have no good idea yet how users will react to what we have. Maybe, after we hear from them, we decide to implement such switches, who knows. > I don't think it reasonable silently to force users into setting the > new modes as defaults. That is so far from what we have that I suspect you haven't read the code closely enough. NEWS explains the situation.