From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [ELPA] New package: transient Date: Sun, 03 May 2020 20:29:25 +0300 Message-ID: <83a72porka.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87368npxw4.fsf@bernoul.li> <87v9ljo5d0.fsf@bernoul.li> <87ftcnxu5m.fsf@bernoul.li> <83y2qezlpd.fsf@gnu.org> <83tv12zjx1.fsf@gnu.org> <20200429101755.GF24737@tuxteam.de> <838sicw4do.fsf@gnu.org> <83zhaqu89z.fsf@gnu.org> <83sggiu2p9.fsf@gnu.org> <83r1w2s9wi.fsf@gnu.org> <83v9leqmss.fsf@gnu.org> <83zhapoz63.fsf@gnu.org> <0a13f7e1-61c7-1e78-22bc-a27c15c269e7@yandex.ru> <83h7wxotix.fsf@gnu.org> <18096f9a-c617-f37b-cdaa-1a6198db2e1c@yandex.ru> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="96207"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: tomas@tuxteam.de, emacs-devel@gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, rms@gnu.org To: Dmitry Gutov Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun May 03 19:30:21 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jVIRZ-000Ox3-Fs for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 19:30:21 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:52714 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jVIRY-0005mz-IX for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 13:30:20 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:51784) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jVIR1-0005M1-BJ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 03 May 2020 13:29:47 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:57126) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jVIR0-0000pT-7F; Sun, 03 May 2020 13:29:46 -0400 Original-Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=4025 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1jVIQl-0003lI-MI; Sun, 03 May 2020 13:29:34 -0400 In-Reply-To: <18096f9a-c617-f37b-cdaa-1a6198db2e1c@yandex.ru> (message from Dmitry Gutov on Sun, 3 May 2020 20:04:38 +0300) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:248725 Archived-At: > Cc: monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, tomas@tuxteam.de, rms@gnu.org, > emacs-devel@gnu.org > From: Dmitry Gutov > Date: Sun, 3 May 2020 20:04:38 +0300 > > The apropos command has pretty much the same problem with filtering and > ordering. Only more difficult, since it offers more matches. It offers more matches because it finds what completion cannot. > > And I don't see what's wrong with that. I saw what I thought was the > > wrong tool for the job, so I suggested to use a better tool. Why do I > > have to "acknowledge" a problem in using a wrong tool, instead of > > pointing out that it's wrong? Why is it "reasonable" to used the > > wrong tool and expect that it produces optimal results? It isn't. > > Calling a tool that many people have been employing for years > "inadequate" is mildly insulting and dismissive of others' experience. I'd rather expect that people would listen to better tools being presented to them, and would consider using them to enrich their experience and make their everyday's life better. There's nothing dismissive in providing answers to questions and pointing out how to get some job done. Otherwise, we'd need to consider entire forums like help-gnu-emacs and reddit "dismissive" and "insulting", which I think is absurd. > Even if I start using apropos and the manual more, I will continue using > code completion and describe-xxx commands nevertheless, and better > naming would still help there. It's okay to decide not to use some of the tools we have, if you don't like them. I'm talking to those who might decide otherwise.