From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: First draft of the Emacs website Date: Fri, 04 Dec 2015 10:42:10 +0200 Message-ID: <838u5aip0d.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87io4lem98.fsf@petton.fr> <56604A9C.7080508@gmail.com> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1449218574 23177 80.91.229.3 (4 Dec 2015 08:42:54 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2015 08:42:54 +0000 (UTC) Cc: drew.adams@oracle.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: John Yates Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Dec 04 09:42:45 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1a4lwy-0005NT-R9 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 04 Dec 2015 09:42:45 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:39434 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a4lwx-0001gs-PA for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 04 Dec 2015 03:42:43 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:38294) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a4lwj-0001gn-K6 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 04 Dec 2015 03:42:30 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a4lwg-0003nt-CT for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 04 Dec 2015 03:42:29 -0500 Original-Received: from mtaout20.012.net.il ([80.179.55.166]:57939) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a4lwg-0003mm-4x for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 04 Dec 2015 03:42:26 -0500 Original-Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout20.012.net.il by a-mtaout20.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0NYT00B00S2QCG00@a-mtaout20.012.net.il> for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 04 Dec 2015 10:42:24 +0200 (IST) Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([84.94.185.246]) by a-mtaout20.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0NYT00B4RS6OB630@a-mtaout20.012.net.il>; Fri, 04 Dec 2015 10:42:24 +0200 (IST) In-reply-to: X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Solaris 10 X-Received-From: 80.179.55.166 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:195856 Archived-At: > Date: Thu, 3 Dec 2015 18:26:16 -0500 > From: John Yates > Cc: Emacs developers > > You and I are old "grey beards". My point was that mentioning things that we - > as seasoned users of Emacs - like is quite a bit different from imagining the > website as a sales pitch to someone who has not used Emacs but _might_ - given > an appropriate message - be coaxed into trying it. If you accept such messaging > as the site's first goal then you have to try to put yourself in the mindset of > such a viewer. > > Your comments suggest that perhaps you do not buy into that being the first > goal. FWIW, I don't think there should be "the goal", in singular, for such a Web site. The stuff there should try to target diverse interests, and let everyone pick up what they are most interested in. Trying to target some virtual newbie, and pretend we know very well what will turn them on or off is bound to break at some point, IMO. For example, the GDB front-end might very well interest someone who needs to debug C/C++/Fortran code on GNU/Linux, where there's no alternative, at least not out of the box, that is better. I remember showing that UI (when it was still not the default one) to several developers that came from VS, and they never wanted anything else ever since. So mentioning it doesn't sound such a silly idea to me, after all. I believe the same could be true with other aspects. E.g., is it such a preposterous assumption that someone might be interested in coding in Lisp, instead of all the ad-hoc extension languages invented by other editors? In sum, it might be TRT to diversify a bit.