From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: delete-selection-mode as default (WAS: Some developement questions) Date: Sat, 08 Sep 2018 10:23:46 +0300 Message-ID: <834lf0tptp.fsf@gnu.org> References: <0CCFABF4-0F2B-4DAA-9C8E-11E1254A325E@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1536391342 8063 195.159.176.226 (8 Sep 2018 07:22:22 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2018 07:22:22 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Bingo Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Sep 08 09:22:18 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1fyXZR-00020g-H0 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 08 Sep 2018 09:22:17 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:41619 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fyXbX-0003iL-VN for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 08 Sep 2018 03:24:27 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:47065) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fyXat-0003i2-PK for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 08 Sep 2018 03:23:48 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fyXaq-0006jU-Kl for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 08 Sep 2018 03:23:47 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:43898) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fyXaq-0006ib-Fy; Sat, 08 Sep 2018 03:23:44 -0400 Original-Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=2007 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1fyXap-0003Bp-R9; Sat, 08 Sep 2018 03:23:44 -0400 In-reply-to: <0CCFABF4-0F2B-4DAA-9C8E-11E1254A325E@gmail.com> (message from Bingo on Sat, 08 Sep 2018 09:19:21 +0530) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:229484 Archived-At: > Date: Sat, 08 Sep 2018 09:19:21 +0530 > From: Bingo > > Can we consider changing defaults only for users who don't have any init file at all ? > > This change may not solve many problems, due to two other features of emacs : What problems will such a change solve? Personally, I think that changing the behavior just because there's an init file, even though that init file doesn't explicitly mention the affected features, would be confusing. More importantly, I think the argument about the defaults, at least for veteran Emacs users matters mainly when there is no init file anyway. > 1. Emacs undo is frustrating for most new users. Correcting mistakes with delete-selection-mode i.e. restore > a selection that was deleted due to a mistaken delete by typing/pasting , will need them to use undo. > > 2. In their attempt to play with undo/redo, they might do C-y. Which pastes in Emacs : but it is the key for redo > in many "modern" editors. This can cause more unintended deletions in delete-selection-mode. So I guess you are saying delete-selection-mode should not be turned on by default? If so, why do we need the change you propose?