From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Concurrency via isolated process/thread Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2023 21:04:57 +0300 Message-ID: <834jmffvhy.fsf@gnu.org> References: <871qhnr4ty.fsf@localhost> <87bkgq8p5t.fsf@localhost> <831qhmjwk0.fsf@gnu.org> <875y6y8nlr.fsf@localhost> <87h6qhnalc.fsf@yahoo.com> <87ilax71wo.fsf@localhost> <878rbtkz2c.fsf@yahoo.com> <87a5w96x2o.fsf@localhost> <87jzvdjjp4.fsf@yahoo.com> <877crd6w53.fsf@localhost> <877crdjiwn.fsf@yahoo.com> <874jmh6v4s.fsf@localhost> <83y1jtgmbw.fsf@gnu.org> <87zg49xfke.fsf@localhost> <83sfa1gjns.fsf@gnu.org> <87r0plxbep.fsf@localhost> <83ilawhpi6.fsf@gnu.org> <87zg48apwr.fsf@localhost> <83edljg8ub.fsf@gnu.org> <87o7knbxr7.fsf@localhost> <838rbrg4mg.fsf@gnu.org> <87ilavbvdr.fsf@localhost> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="11572"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: luangruo@yahoo.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Ihor Radchenko Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Jul 07 20:05:58 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qHpq9-0002n0-Mk for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 07 Jul 2023 20:05:57 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qHppB-00054U-86; Fri, 07 Jul 2023 14:04:57 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qHpp9-000523-GO for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 07 Jul 2023 14:04:55 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qHpp8-0006g1-Uz; Fri, 07 Jul 2023 14:04:54 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=HQX0QArc+SYba4D5RdKd3bwM46kpwBhDWrXHKXGfW0M=; b=hcMDBKv+893D kJNO3M4OyFHi2GP+WQqbOGs/qLTJiaQFs5TCrQPVUdli/NvC38amN1dluajLGV3nIsDnXGr0LYC7O gxXo6TdefWUoeMu+lA/3Q24uUBmfk9A4lDTtrVWAbIb9vOtOa4giXTgLVZQX4ouMKDHMhe30g6tOw WXNOIZHczL6I3Kw75Xfgo2+YZUzL4sctHYxIBVILGHzsBylB1xyA6KYqt6nTGEr5CduIG46mBkDq5 mmZbkQD0ztzbU/suzUJHnELAM/ccrx+dsRxocgCV9hc3rGuCccTEy5NbGAB/+HewYgtkREYUMHyw5 5SneAEiBwkORAeNJXG3eVQ==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qHpp8-0004MQ-Er; Fri, 07 Jul 2023 14:04:54 -0400 In-Reply-To: <87ilavbvdr.fsf@localhost> (message from Ihor Radchenko on Fri, 07 Jul 2023 15:21:04 +0000) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:307583 Archived-At: > From: Ihor Radchenko > Cc: luangruo@yahoo.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org > Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2023 15:21:04 +0000 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > >> What GC is doing may affect C pointers to internal representations of > >> Elisp objects. But never the Lisp representations. > > > > What do you mean by "Lisp representation"? > > We clearly misunderstand each other. > May you please provide a concrete example how running GC breaks things? I already did: see my description of compacting strings, relocating buffer text, and other stuff GC does. > >> Ok. Please, describe the elephant in details. > > > > I already did: it's the huge global state used implicitly by every > > Lisp program out there. > > I am interested in specific details. The way you say it now is general > and sounds like "it is impossible and there is no point trying to do > anything". That's indeed what I want to say. You cannot have true concurrency as long as Emacs Lisp programs use this huge global state.