From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Stability of core packages (was: Not easy at all to upgrade :core packages like Eglot) Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2023 16:44:53 +0300 Message-ID: <83354w7zqi.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87a5zj2vfo.fsf@gmail.com> <87leiwdyff.fsf@posteo.net> <834jpk5hih.fsf@gnu.org> <871qkom3fj.fsf@posteo.net> <83mt3b4yfc.fsf@gnu.org> <87edonlsxi.fsf@posteo.net> <83jzyf4vzb.fsf@gnu.org> <871qknllkj.fsf@posteo.net> <83fs934pjf.fsf@gnu.org> <87wn2fk47y.fsf@posteo.net> <83sfd2g2ek.fsf@gnu.org> <875y9yfxrr.fsf@gmail.com> <87y1muefks.fsf@gmail.com> <834jpifizy.fsf@gnu.org> <83y1mue1qi.fsf@gnu.org> <83sfd2e01f.fsf@gnu.org> <1a5e5837-513b-84d8-3260-cdbf42b71267@gutov.dev> <83sfcz9rf2.fsf@gnu.org> <09a49ab9-ac72-36a9-3e68-9c633710eba7@gutov.dev> <83r0sh8i1q.fsf@gnu.org> <35638c9d-e13f-fad8-5f95-ea03d65d4aa2@gmail.com> <838reo821e.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="22878"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: jporterbugs@gmail.com, dmitry@gutov.dev, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: =?utf-8?B?Sm/Do28gVMOhdm9yYQ==?= Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Apr 19 15:45:50 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pp886-0005oN-KI for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 19 Apr 2023 15:45:50 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pp873-0003aF-5K; Wed, 19 Apr 2023 09:44:45 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pp871-0003Zy-S1 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 19 Apr 2023 09:44:43 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pp871-0001aZ-Dm; Wed, 19 Apr 2023 09:44:43 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=QgGzFPIOTw4UaOBtm2C0ovkocHZCZn/Fu1w4mhv/Fmk=; b=OnNTSLcnhWkHjlNUFhyS ipcG8EeX3QJruk7A5KgW82fcOoEmDyarkohTmSFUwc1gr3TMKPjoCpVpfYe5+qZuUuY7GCXhodzOz VsdfaN+2JXrDOkRhjVfNzrSVdAjIleNgWmkT6ZuCHikx/HEIkfNLUscc6fiWmez1755XHZgojSqkQ xv/yftzZFHJgP7Gk1Cy0KJL/TK16eZ6Q/9pXsv/8EIDxUoYFIQyN6cdagXftPMianNhDDPNtPXo9X xJ5ef3kX8xHrIR2bpeLoPcig36QMfp9IMCdKolL0Lv9bBgnYBdPYNYMpKOJtAMd0OUAO9wWodMSt9 1efIEnsPc32VfA==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pp870-00054w-PW; Wed, 19 Apr 2023 09:44:43 -0400 In-Reply-To: (message from =?utf-8?B?Sm/Do28gVMOhdm9yYQ==?= on Wed, 19 Apr 2023 14:18:21 +0100) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:305440 Archived-At: > From: João Távora > Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2023 14:18:21 +0100 > Cc: jporterbugs@gmail.com, dmitry@gutov.dev, emacs-devel@gnu.org > > > > These are interesting levels, but I was under the impression > > > that the goal is to partition the set of :core packages according > > > to some kind of gradation, what Eli called "stability gradation". > > > The set can be found in the variable package--builtins. > > > > No you've misunderstood what I mean by "stability gradation". It has > > nothing to do with the value of package--builtins, even when that is > > non-nil. > > OK, but you wrote: > > IOW, shouldn't packages have some "stability gradation" that is > visible when users look at the list of packages via package.el? Yes. > By "have some" I interpreted that you wanted to map a given > characteristic to each package. And by "packages" I interpreted > that you meant the packages that the Emacs project has control > over. And those packages are, by definition, the ":core" or > "builtin" packages (although if the Emacs project is taken to > include ELPA .git, it will also include all the packages there). > > If I've misunderstood, I think you could give examples of > real or made up packages and assign a "stability gradation" to > them and define what that gradation means. In the "list-packages" display, instead of eglot 1.14 available gnu The Emacs Client for LSP servers I envisioned seeing something like eglot 2.01 alpha gnu The Emacs Client for LSP servers eglot 1.20 current gnu The Emacs Client for LSP servers eglot 1.15 stable gnu The Emacs Client for LSP servers eglot 1.14 previous gnu The Emacs Client for LSP servers eglot 1.12 built-in gnu The Emacs Client for LSP servers where the 3rd column is the "stability gradation" I had in mind. I also envisioned some user option, say, package-preferred-stabilty, which users could set to a value such as 'stable', and then package.el will only automatically update a package to a newer version when the new version satisfies the stability criteria per the value of that option. > Then explain what you want to do with that stability gradation > in Emacs (if anything, perhaps you just want to show it). If the above doesn't explain this, I don't think I understand the question. What do you mean by "do with that in Emacs"?