RE: GNU Emacs raison d'etre

[Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>]

> >  > * Tell newcomers up front that Emacs really starts to be worth it
> >  > * after a few years, not a few weeks.
> >
> >I don't believe that is true.  It is an exaggeration.
> 
> Well, it's not a rhetorical exaggeration, in any case.  That is, it is
> my actual belief, based on observation.  (It could be wrong, of course,
> but just to be clear, it wasn't an exaggeration for the sake of
> effect.)

It all depends on what one interprets "really" as.

I agree with you, for "_REALLY!_".  I agree with RMS
for "really", as in you get some real worth immediately.

But overall, I agree with the point you were making,
which I think is that the more you invest with Emacs
the more it's worth it, and if you invest only a tiny
amount (e.g. you just started using it) then you might
not see much of what it really has to offer.

Trying to pack such a message into just "really"
doesn't work, in general.

> Different people will naturally learn at different rates, depending on
> their aptitude and environment.  The best environment is to have an
> Emacs expert nearby in person, who can occasionally watch the newcomer
> edit and point out faster ways to do things, point out ways to ask
> Emacs for help, etc.  But even in that kind of environment, with a
> talented newcomer, I don't think I've seen it take less than
> approximately a year to get to the point where they are doing better
> with Emacs than they would have done with some less extensible, less
> capable text editor.
> 
> >  > * Also tell them about the ways in which Emacs may frustrate them
> >  > * along the way, and explain that those frustrations are common
> >  > * and are sometimes inevitably entangled with the same things that
> >  > * make Emacs winning in the long term.
> >
> >This sounds like a recipe for discouraging people from starting.
> 
> To me it is just realistic, and if I were a newcomer I'd want to be
> informed of it.

I agree, but I'm not sure how best to pass that message.

There are surely _some_ newcomers who might not get
that Emacs is a fine instrument.  There _is_ a lot to
learn, to make fine music.  But yes, you can get some
melody out of it without much practice.

I do think that newbies should be encouraged, not
discouraged.  But they should also know that Emacs is
like a piano or a lathe - there's more to it than meets
the eye.

> Teaching newcomers how to use these accidental stumbles to their
> advantage is important, and I always try to do so.  But I find it helps
> to let them know that it's going to happen often -- that Emacs will
> react in unexpected ways and surprise them, and that persisting through
> that initial fog of unexpected reactions is worth the effort.

Unexpected in terms of naive, uninformed expectations.
Which is why any intro/tutorial needs to stress the
importance of Emacs help/doc.

There is little that is unexpected in the sense of
unpredictable or undocumented.

> A perfect analogy is manual ("stick") transmission cars versus
> automatic transmission cars.  A stick car is harder for a newcomer to
> drive, but gives an experienced user more control than she would
> otherwise have.  An automatic transmission car is easier for a
> newcomer, but frustrating for the expert because it limits (a bit) what
> she can do.
> 
> Does this mean that no one learns to drive stick?  Of course not.  Some
> people do so by choice -- they make a conscious investment, made with
> the understanding that driving will be *harder* for a while before
> there is any discernable payoff.  But they are willing to make that
> choice because others told them how it would be worth it.  It's not
> something the user would find out from reading the manual for the car,
> though.

The analogy is pretty good (not perfect).  The last
sentence doesn't correspond to Emacs, though, I think.

You _can_ learn Emacs by reading its manuals and its
help (`C-h').  Asking Emacs is a good way to learn.
Maybe not as good as the expert-over-your-shoulder
method you cited, but pretty good.