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From: "Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com>
To: <rms@gnu.org>, "'Stefan Monnier'" <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: RE: Loading souce Elisp faster
Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2013 07:35:28 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <75C9FC0FD46245178BDC311A05B53B3F@us.oracle.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <E1U9wT9-0008Ec-H7@fencepost.gnu.org>

>     Do we need to support non-utf-8 elisp files? I say we 
>     convert all of them (those in our control) to utf-8 and
>     be done with it.
> 
> We could do this, but we still need to support other people's 
> Lisp code, so we can't drop support for other coding systems.
> 
> Even changing the default might break things for users.

Amen.

Some files need to be compatible with older Emacs versions.
Embedded Unicode chars in such files can be problematic.

(And using a BOM is also not a good idea, IMHO.)

What is wrong with continuing to use an explicit declaration for UTF-8?  I saw
no good argument for such a change.

This is the closest to an argument that I've seen:

> And given that utf-8 should be the standard encoding for Elisp
> files (if not quite now, surely in some not too distant future),
> this is an important case.

Where "this" is the case of optimizing the use of UTF-8 files by avoiding an
unnecessary `load-with-code-conversion'.

But AFAICT, nothing stops Emacs from doing that anyway.  Just declare that the
file is UTF-8 explicitly.  Where's the beef?

I am all in favor of using Unicode in Emacs and beyond.  Best thing that's
happened to Emacs in years, in fact.  But just because an encoding becomes the
new "standard" does not mean that other encodings should no longer be supported.

And that means continued support in older releases as well.  It does no good to
introduce something now to distinguish non-UTF-8 in new releases, if that won't
be recognized in older releases.




  parent reply	other threads:[~2013-02-25 15:35 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 90+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2013-02-25  1:40 Loading souce Elisp faster Stefan Monnier
2013-02-25  1:53 ` Lennart Borgman
2013-02-25  2:53   ` Stefan Monnier
2013-02-25  2:55     ` Lennart Borgman
2013-02-25  3:57       ` Stefan Monnier
2013-02-25  4:35         ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2013-02-25  4:51           ` Stefan Monnier
2013-02-25  5:24         ` Paul Eggert
2013-02-25  6:12           ` Xue Fuqiao
2013-02-25 15:39           ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-02-25 18:41             ` Paul Eggert
2013-02-26  7:23               ` Werner LEMBERG
2013-02-26  8:48                 ` Andreas Schwab
2013-02-25  5:47         ` Leo Liu
2013-02-25 16:28         ` Ted Zlatanov
2013-02-27  4:18         ` Kenichi Handa
2013-02-27 13:48           ` Stefan Monnier
2013-02-27 14:50             ` Drew Adams
2013-02-27 17:49             ` Werner LEMBERG
2013-02-27 14:28           ` Richard Stallman
2013-02-28 14:10             ` Kenichi Handa
2013-03-01  2:12               ` Richard Stallman
2013-03-02 12:52                 ` Kenichi Handa
2013-03-03  0:35                   ` Richard Stallman
2013-03-10 15:19                 ` handa
2013-03-11  1:19                   ` Richard Stallman
2013-03-15 16:20                   ` handa
2013-03-20  8:15                     ` Kenichi Handa
2013-02-25  7:24 ` Achim Gratz
2013-02-25 11:43 ` Richard Stallman
2013-02-25 15:19   ` Stefan Monnier
2013-02-25 15:36     ` Drew Adams
2013-02-25 16:09       ` Stefan Monnier
2013-02-25 16:31         ` Lennart Borgman
2013-02-25 18:31           ` Stefan Monnier
2013-02-25 19:20             ` Lennart Borgman
2013-02-25 20:53               ` Stefan Monnier
2013-02-25 20:57                 ` Lennart Borgman
2013-02-25 21:37                   ` Stefan Monnier
2013-02-25 21:57                     ` Lennart Borgman
2013-02-25 23:59                       ` Lennart Borgman
2013-02-26 17:27                         ` Achim Gratz
2013-02-26 21:38                           ` Lennart Borgman
2013-02-26 21:43                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2013-02-26 21:47                               ` Lennart Borgman
2013-02-26  4:54           ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2013-02-26  8:29             ` Ulrich Mueller
2013-02-25 21:51     ` Richard Stallman
2013-02-25 23:54       ` Stefan Monnier
2013-02-25 15:35   ` Drew Adams [this message]
2013-02-25 13:33 ` Kenichi Handa
2013-02-25 13:50   ` Xue Fuqiao
2013-02-25 15:35     ` Drew Adams
2013-02-25 15:52     ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-02-25 22:39       ` Xue Fuqiao
2013-02-26  3:48         ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-02-26 10:44           ` Xue Fuqiao
2013-02-26 17:02             ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-02-25 15:35   ` Drew Adams
2013-02-25 16:45 ` David Engster
2013-02-26 12:56   ` Richard Stallman
2013-02-26 16:26     ` David Engster
2013-02-26 20:19       ` Richard Stallman
2013-02-26 21:00         ` David Engster
2013-02-26 21:12           ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-02-26 21:18             ` David Engster
2013-02-26 22:40               ` Xue Fuqiao
2013-02-26 22:51               ` David Engster
2013-02-27  0:44                 ` Drew Adams
2013-02-27  1:22           ` Stefan Monnier
2013-02-27  1:56             ` Lennart Borgman
2013-02-27 14:28             ` Richard Stallman
2013-02-27 15:21               ` Stefan Monnier
2013-02-27 17:21                 ` Lennart Borgman
2013-02-27 18:31             ` Achim Gratz
2013-02-27 18:39               ` Drew Adams
2013-02-27 19:28                 ` Achim Gratz
2013-02-27 22:32                   ` Xue Fuqiao
2013-02-27 18:43               ` Lennart Borgman
2013-02-27  4:49           ` Kenichi Handa
2013-02-27 14:27           ` Richard Stallman
2013-02-26 16:57     ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-02-26 20:19       ` Richard Stallman
2013-02-26 20:45         ` Eli Zaretskii
2013-02-27  2:22     ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2013-02-25 21:12 ` Ivan Kanis
2013-02-25 22:47   ` Glenn Morris
2013-02-25 21:17 ` Barry Warsaw
2013-02-26  7:10   ` Thierry Volpiatto
2013-02-26  7:59 ` Andreas Röhler

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