From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Chad Brown Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: long-standing set-up errors on upgrade (elimination of x cut buffers) Date: Mon, 20 Sep 2010 09:24:28 -0700 Message-ID: <74CBA14C-D240-4148-9752-EB3295CD86C2@mit.edu> References: <201009150110.o8F1AQGX093877@kzsu.stanford.edu> <201009192239.o8JMdoW6096410@kzsu.stanford.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1081) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-92--397493140 X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1284999888 23552 80.91.229.12 (20 Sep 2010 16:24:48 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 20 Sep 2010 16:24:48 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Joe Brenner Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Sep 20 18:24:46 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OxjAa-0003jl-8f for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 20 Sep 2010 18:24:44 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46991 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OxjAZ-0007qf-MI for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 20 Sep 2010 12:24:43 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=53173 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OxjAQ-0007oW-TA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 20 Sep 2010 12:24:36 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OxjAO-0004tl-SR for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 20 Sep 2010 12:24:34 -0400 Original-Received: from dmz-mailsec-scanner-7.mit.edu ([18.7.68.36]:64757) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OxjAO-0004tf-QW for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 20 Sep 2010 12:24:32 -0400 X-AuditID: 12074424-b7b2bae000005b3f-a8-4c978aa6d487 Original-Received: from mailhub-auth-4.mit.edu ( [18.7.62.39]) by dmz-mailsec-scanner-7.mit.edu (Symantec Brightmail Gateway) with SMTP id D3.87.23359.6AA879C4; Mon, 20 Sep 2010 12:24:06 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (OUTGOING-AUTH.MIT.EDU [18.7.22.103]) by mailhub-auth-4.mit.edu (8.13.8/8.9.2) with ESMTP id o8KGOVKf008873; Mon, 20 Sep 2010 12:24:32 -0400 Original-Received: from [10.0.1.194] (c-71-231-113-235.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [71.231.113.235]) (authenticated bits=0) (User authenticated as yandros@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.13.6/8.12.4) with ESMTP id o8KGOShc009102 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Mon, 20 Sep 2010 12:24:30 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: <201009192239.o8JMdoW6096410@kzsu.stanford.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1081) X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAARYGOcM= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:130542 Archived-At: --Apple-Mail-92--397493140 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On Sep 19, 2010, at 3:39 PM, Joe Brenner wrote: > (Of late, the gnus emacs team seems to be having trouble with the idea > of stable interfaces.) I don't think any of these have anything to do with gnus, but are definitely interface changes in emacs, potentially in the development trunk (i.e. the bleeding edge). > One example I'm not sure about any more: I could swear emacs had > suddenly switched to "typing-replaces-selection" behavior (standard on > post-Macintosh interfaces perhaps, but never in emacs). Now I don't > think I'm seeing that behavior any more. You would see this behavior if you were using the development trunk (i.e. bzr HEAD) of emacs 24, unless you turned it off. That interface is still somewhat `under development' at the moment, so changes are expected. Unless something changes, I would guess that ``typing replaces selection'' will be the default behavior in a future emacs release. > One that's been a minor annoyance to me is that repeated C-l's are no > longer a no-op, but flip the display around in a new way that took some > getting used to. You might want to customize the variable recenter-positions to disable this new feature (which seems to have been introduced in Emacs 23.2). I was quite pleasantly surprised to find it myself, as it more elegantly solves a problem for which I'd long had a custom key binding. There are very few changes to the emacs interface that aren't easily turned off. If you're using the development head straight from the source repository, you should expect to see these sort of changes now and then; if such changes are unacceptable to you, then you probably shouldn't be trying to use the active development code. If you need some patch or bug fix from the development HEAD but don't want to live on the bleeding edge, I would suggest filling a bug report and asking if we can please put out a bug-fix release for your particular issue. Hope that helps, *Chad --Apple-Mail-92--397493140 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
(Of = late, the gnus emacs team seems to be having trouble with the = idea
of stable = interfaces.)

I don't think any of = these have anything to do with gnus, but are = definitely 
interface changes in emacs, potentially in = the development trunk (i.e. the 
bleeding = edge).

One example I'm not sure = about any more: I could swear emacs had
suddenly switched to = "typing-replaces-selection" behavior (standard on
post-Macintosh = interfaces perhaps, but never in emacs).  Now I don't
think I'm = seeing that behavior any = more.

You would see this = behavior if you were using the development trunk (i.e.
bzr = HEAD) of emacs 24, unless you turned it off.  That interface is = still
somewhat `under development' at the moment, so changes = are expected.

Unless something changes, I would = guess that ``typing replaces selection''
will be the default = behavior in a future emacs release.  

One that's been a minor annoyance to me is that = repeated C-l's are no
longer a no-op, but flip the display around in = a new way that took some
getting used to.

You = might want to customize the variable recenter-positions to = disable 
this new feature (which seems to have been = introduced in Emacs 23.2).
I was quite pleasantly surprised to = find it myself, as it more elegantly
solves a problem for = which I'd long had a custom = key binding.

There are very few changes to = the emacs interface that aren't easily 
turned off. =  If you're using the development head straight from the = source
repository, you should expect to see these sort of = changes now and then;
if such changes are unacceptable to you, = then you probably shouldn't be
trying to use the active = development code.  If you need some patch or bug
fix from = the development HEAD but don't want to live on the bleeding = edge,
I would suggest filling a bug report and asking if we = can please put out a 
bug-fix release for your particular = issue.

Hope that = helps,
*Chad

= --Apple-Mail-92--397493140--