From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: On committing significant and/or controversial changes Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2024 04:16:04 +0200 Message-ID: <728.314630553939$1732933035@news.gmane.org> References: <3972.40662002645$1732415815@news.gmane.org> <1cf4771d-4950-4871-a6ff-a908d8262539@alphapapa.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="27335"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Cc: eliz@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Adam Porter Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Nov 30 03:17:08 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1tHD2h-0006y2-Cg for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 30 Nov 2024 03:17:07 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tHD1u-0001cT-0M; Fri, 29 Nov 2024 21:16:18 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tHD1r-0001cA-7v for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 29 Nov 2024 21:16:15 -0500 Original-Received: from thaodan.de ([185.216.177.71]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tHD1o-0003W3-GT; Fri, 29 Nov 2024 21:16:14 -0500 Original-Received: from odin (dsl-trebng12-50dc7b-49.dhcp.inet.fi [80.220.123.49]) by thaodan.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4F215D0004F; Sat, 30 Nov 2024 04:16:06 +0200 (EET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=thaodan.de; s=mail; t=1732932966; bh=no8qqj7iFvQrX4jSsmpSnEjIbzkHZJWFM3K4aUwVtPE=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date; b=nqmnYKohyEXAu6nUZB6EzhQnjbYreQ6anSCBvpxFv60fRxExuOoPWOtaHD5KLe65z czEQnkEzB03ZReH+LQAUmYz9gs/3hXMaZ4+zB/Mf0s/dliUQ+PDr6qb+b1hhS/0qFg BuqkA7TWgFD9DTDQ13rjbQ+EpJZ2IXX2RZfgxcrKxZNTS4d9TTL0pc6ZmpKNUbLOGr Fk7KVqT5UvNftQhaWniv29ikecYanVmLNaa8epMX+Dk1RMo2FqnwAVQPz20HRqocrX sWFtK5mc1OQxJG8/FaVaMTYORIMr+Txnb5XCDXNVry3J0KV9ZsEYNf7YWpUdbc2rmz bqCowhqkOTtpfuUuuJ0eH6KNiwPueyyeOJ5uLwoW+F7j1CSnLviaOpEBK/Dwvwi4hN x0AvzauMaPiURjmuCjfte/el0XHKOvECE3GXyR3ubemD8QAPvGlFkwOrcL1P2VNauU Wp4sX/tpTifQL126ORpl/uofrRHaJ28kPxjnHMc35lcpTIy5mBGP0puvzXUaajW+5j dhm065oGicRCWUbg9gNcVMsPXe6KgSV2qaG/1VBzKKQlCWzHUb/QG6ZcehX+NhfcXC FK+gFCMW0CYFa3NbKaMLNo5NaW6Xa/OGACgn+Kk4c5aHtE9wE+nFCDMg4DzltP589U FQBMswTOD0e9b7LBDVlQ+Yzw= In-Reply-To: <1cf4771d-4950-4871-a6ff-a908d8262539@alphapapa.net> (Adam Porter's message of "Sat, 23 Nov 2024 22:41:28 -0600") Autocrypt: addr=bjorn.bidar@thaodan.de; prefer-encrypt=nopreference; keydata= mDMEZNfpPhYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdACBEmr+0xwIIHZfIDlZmm7sa+lHHSb0g9FZrN6qE6ru60JUJq w7ZybiBCaWRhciA8Ympvcm4uYmlkYXJAdGhhb2Rhbi5kZT6IlgQTFgoAPgIbAwULCQgHAgIiAgYV CgkICwIEFgIDAQIeBwIXgBYhBFHxdut1RzAepymoq1wbdKFlHF9oBQJk1/YmAhkBAAoJEFwbdKFl HF9oB9cBAJoIIGQKXm4cpap+Flxc/EGnYl0123lcEyzuduqvlDT0AQC3OlFKm/OiqJ8IMTrzJRZ8 phFssTkSrrFXnM2jm5PYDoiTBBMWCgA7FiEEUfF263VHMB6nKairXBt0oWUcX2gFAmTX6T4CGwMF CwkIBwICIgIGFQoJCAsCBBYCAwECHgcCF4AACgkQXBt0oWUcX2hbCQEAtru7kvM8hi8zo6z9ux2h K+B5xViKuo7Z8K3IXuK5ugwA+wUfKzomzdBPhfxDsqLcEziGRxoyx0Q3ld9aermBUccHtBxCasO2 cm4gQmlkYXIgPG1lQHRoYW9kYW4uZGU+iJMEExYKADsCGwMFCwkIBwICIgIGFQoJCAsCBBYCAwEC HgcCF4AWIQRR8XbrdUcwHqcpqKtcG3ShZRxfaAUCZNf2FQAKCRBcG3ShZRxfaCzSAP4hZ7cSp0YN XYpcjHdsySh2MuBhhoPeLGXs+2kSiqBiOwD/TP8AgPEg/R+SI9GI9on7fBJJ0mp2IT8kZ2rhDOjg gA6IkwQTFgoAOxYhBFHxdut1RzAepymoq1wbdKFlH Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.216.177.71; envelope-from=bjorn.bidar@thaodan.de; helo=thaodan.de X-Spam_score_int: -14 X-Spam_score: -1.5 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.5 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, INVALID_MSGID=0.568, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_RPBL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_SAFE_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:325862 Archived-At: Adam Porter writes: > Bj=C3=B6rn, > >> Change is hard but without change issues will potentially keep existing. >> Making use of features that different systems offer can help to relieve >> some of the friction and make communication of changes easier. >> It would be best to take the things learned by people outside of the >> personal bubble into account. Often they can show use things that we >> have become blind to or would have never thought of in the first place. > > Your comments could be interpreted as condescending, so as to suggest > that Eli and the Emacs maintainers were stubbornly ignorant of > development practices outside of the GNU Emacs project. Hm? I didn't write such a thing. I'm just saying sometimes someone outside of ones own social bubble can bring viewpoints or influences that we usually are not exposed to. Being stubborn is a totally different thing. > [...] > > So to imply that the maintainers are not well versed in alternatives, > and that their decisions for this project are made carelessly, borders > on rudeness. Eli patiently explained why these practices are used, > and until you wrangle a project as large and varied as this one, you > ought to present your suggestions more respectfully. You imply that I imply. I just suggest to use more features from software such as git and look at FOSS projects outside of GNU for improvements. Implying something which I didn't write is also rude.