From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Paul Eggert Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [PATCH] Make display-time-mode time zone configurable Date: Sun, 21 Feb 2016 21:27:09 -0800 Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department Message-ID: <56CA9C2D.50504@cs.ucla.edu> References: <87fuwt8wek.fsf@udel.edu> <56C2A950.3080102@cs.ucla.edu> <20160219023723.GB15748@holos> <56C6A0CC.1080007@cs.ucla.edu> <20160219171437.GA9456@holos> <56C758C6.90702@cs.ucla.edu> <20160222004556.GA5187@holos> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1456118860 32613 80.91.229.3 (22 Feb 2016 05:27:40 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2016 05:27:40 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Mark Oteiza Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Feb 22 06:27:25 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1aXj1k-0001UH-Ou for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 22 Feb 2016 06:27:21 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:47115 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aXj1j-0005bQ-PP for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 22 Feb 2016 00:27:19 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:36683) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aXj1f-0005bG-VA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Feb 2016 00:27:16 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aXj1c-00011k-Pk for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Feb 2016 00:27:15 -0500 Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([131.179.128.68]:33851) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aXj1c-00011N-Jg for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Feb 2016 00:27:12 -0500 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8AD8F160193; Sun, 21 Feb 2016 21:27:10 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id Hp5G3xYTP5O0; Sun, 21 Feb 2016 21:27:09 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2491160FC1; Sun, 21 Feb 2016 21:27:09 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at zimbra.cs.ucla.edu Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id xkXrPrwNeXpl; Sun, 21 Feb 2016 21:27:09 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from [192.168.1.9] (pool-100-32-155-148.lsanca.fios.verizon.net [100.32.155.148]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 90BC1160193; Sun, 21 Feb 2016 21:27:09 -0800 (PST) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.1 In-Reply-To: <20160222004556.GA5187@holos> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 131.179.128.68 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:200437 Archived-At: Mark Oteiza wrote: > On 19/02/16 at 10:02am, Paul Eggert wrote: >> >On 02/19/2016 09:14 AM, Mark Oteiza wrote: >>> > >My first thought of a use-case is simply keeping time zone in the mode >>> > >line the same regardless of what the system time (or local time) may be, >>> > >akin to not changing one's watch when travelling. >> > >> >That's easily done with (setenv "TZ" "America/Los_Angeles"), or whatever you >> >want the mode-line's time zone to be. > Sure, if you want to globally change the time zone in emacs and all the > subprocesses it spawns, Which is the normal case. Users who want to affect Emacs but not subprocesses can call set-time-zone-rule instead of setenv. Admittedly we steer users away from that sort of thing, as it leads to confusion. > which is counter to the purpose of the defcustom > in the first place--to expose convenient fine control of the displayed > time zone in display-time-mode. I'm afraid we're starting to go in circles. I'm curious about why one would want to change just the mode-line's time zone, and you're responding that it's because one would want to change just the mode-line's time zone. :-) We needn't add a control knob for every Emacs behavior, only behaviors for which the benefit in fine-grained control outweighs the cost in confusion and complexity. The cost/benefit tradeoff for this will differ among users. Expert users who need this sort of fine-grained control already have it; as far as I can see, nonexpert users don't need it enough to justify its complexity.