From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David Caldwell Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: First draft of the Emacs website Date: Sun, 29 Nov 2015 00:15:39 -0800 Message-ID: <565AB42B.50105@porkrind.org> References: <87io4lem98.fsf@petton.fr> <87bnadegt8.fsf@petton.fr> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha-256; boundary="------------ms030304020708080507070907" X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1448797371 30968 80.91.229.3 (29 Nov 2015 11:42:51 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 29 Nov 2015 11:42:51 +0000 (UTC) To: Random832 , emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Nov 29 12:42:39 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1a30N8-0004il-W1 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 29 Nov 2015 12:42:27 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:35292 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a2x9s-0006mO-Ma for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 29 Nov 2015 03:16:32 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:55475) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a2x9e-0006mI-44 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 29 Nov 2015 03:16:19 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a2x9a-0002PO-Tx for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 29 Nov 2015 03:16:18 -0500 Original-Received: from sa38.galvanix.net ([98.126.48.38]:60062 helo=kill.porkrind.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a2x9a-0002Nu-JL for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 29 Nov 2015 03:16:14 -0500 Original-Received: from porkrind.org (cpe-23-241-25-146.socal.res.rr.com [23.241.25.146]) by kill.porkrind.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4A1605F2CE; Sun, 29 Nov 2015 00:15:44 -0800 (PST) Authentication-Results: kill.porkrind.org; dkim=pass (1536-bit key; unprotected) header.d=porkrind.org header.i=@porkrind.org header.b=RoMPlGYt; dkim-atps=neutral Original-Received: from [10.0.0.10] (black.local [10.0.0.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by porkrind.org (8.15.2/8.15.2/Debian-2) with ESMTPSA id tAT8FetJ004762 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128 verify=NOT); Sun, 29 Nov 2015 00:15:42 -0800 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=porkrind.org; s=apoptygma; t=1448784943; bh=UBrVIaBuJJt37Z10Y5Ewf3vtZM2wcnu5984a1R+9oX4=; h=Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=RoMPlGYt9u/R6/uo4rPccGyMXYraNzv70mepfHpGsw+X/wlv+bUhEY8TAL4Rwbr9i srmemxcmCVM7qbM4LT0fxXcK23qt7mjFkf7Ik5vaLSOmM5FUzRcTBghgTDHI6KfQMn WAus8+ROK7blvFRBGxyptwi7WbKFLZiAyiQbACKdiikPtZpTK0UAUMBy/tJ+T5eL0z 59g0LtqtrB0Zotvbyvj4YVpMN1HtCrIxhQxhJ2PsnOoY/Gaq/yMaxfzhsTa X-Enigmail-Draft-Status: N1110 Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwCAQAAAD9CzEMAAAACXBIWXMAAAsTAAALEwEAmpwY AAAABGdBTUEAALGOfPtRkwAAACBjSFJNAAB6JQAAgIMAAPn/AACA6QAAdTAAAOpgAAA6mAAAF2+S X8VGAAABiklEQVR42rRYSZIDIQwzLv7/ZXLoEAzeBKG7ag4DRhZeBKQ0Qr5imLWCrKwn0HImc1Mx aAvmmc/cuAT7RMYws6v/gHeb0p4/y5792GJJlLZWOPgsdV5NaRes4Xe4632sLljD7wKv1Ta74H/h MxecN1Rc2TatYcP7zb+6WFfN/zMSHg1Ymuxjrzd+DuLw6Nlekggt1hvr7KK9tRIX85jjM6GTYhfv nzXH3jBdYc4koueBs66M+Xv9O9n5ML4urWssjGeMY3if3bzGSvk30BQ46OOaxJjLCpzPJAzXrOrD z5VFh58TIiwESIiCHNxxwPTy97qDei8YdpVdyYEv6EQcK8n+iTyE/Cn1eoe7HwN+F56oErVSGtJY Q1sR2ehaUHfjvJuv0tL7qAzEbBmfF2IHrVi8zp9N0pZtQZZHOXp/sLW4+hqKvm3iccaPwP3XgnKX n8/YtVeOsnenRG7VCBFlZ5fe3LOyANCVdGAIwDs7tTXGF4hIk15/iAfSgv2UkNFItSszOG3Ha7r0 GQBerhBkHOAzmQAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:42.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/42.0 In-Reply-To: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 98.126.48.38 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:195522 Archived-At: This is a cryptographically signed message in MIME format. --------------ms030304020708080507070907 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 11/28/15 9:42 PM, Random832 wrote: > The advantage [to the extent that it is an advantage] of the version at= > emacsformacosx.com is that it is a self-contained binary distribution > not requiring one to open a terminal and paste magic shell scripts, but= > a more or less standard build (vs Aquamacs which is a fairly extensive > patch set). >=20 > One disadvantage (well, technically I haven't examined whether any of > the others do anything about this) is that it doesn't do anything to > ensure that "emacs" from the terminal won't run the ancient bundled > Emacs (still 22, I think the last time this came up the theory was that= > Apple balked at the GPLv3). >=20 > It might be best to have the OSX button to go to a landing page that > outlines all of these options. An off-site link with no explanation > isn't going to inspire confidence at any rate; even if there's no > discussion of options a landing page with "OSX builds are not provided > directly by the FSF, but Emacs is available through [link]Homebrew[/]" > would be a better transition. For what it's worth, I run emacsformacosx.com. Your points are spot on. I'll also mention that Homebrew also currently has the advantage of being able to link with librsvg, imagemagick, and gnutls=E2=80=94it's on = my list of things to do to figure out how to bundle the dependencies up in Emacs.app so distribution works seamlessly. Emacs on OS X is always a little weird, because I tend to see Emacs users as mostly command-line centric, but Mac users as a whole definitely are not. When you look at the other Mac editors out there that people really like, they are all GUI based. SublimeText, TextMate, Atom, Xcode are the ones I think of. Homebrew fits with the command line centric view of the world. I love it and use it for almost all classic unix software I install, but there are definitely Mac Emacs users out there that do not use it. I think emacsformacosx.com is popular[1] because it fits with the thinking of Mac folks (just download a .dmg and drag-to-install) while still being plain old Emacs. At any rate, if the FSF wants official Emacs binaries for Mac OS X, I'm willing to help out. I've been making and distributing them for 15 years (since the Mac OS X 10.0 Beta) and I'll most likely keep doing it until I stop using Emacs or my Mac. -David [1] It averages about 1000 downloads per day, with odd spikes of about 3x the average. These happen around releases, but also randomly though the year=E2=80=93I suspect due to links from various blogs that end up on= Twitter or Hacker News or Reddit. --------------ms030304020708080507070907 Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExDzANBglghkgBZQMEAgEFADCABgkqhkiG9w0BBwEAAKCC DGAwggYkMIIFDKADAgECAgMM240wDQYJKoZIhvcNAQELBQAwgYwxCzAJBgNVBAYTAklMMRYw FAYDVQQKEw1TdGFydENvbSBMdGQuMSswKQYDVQQLEyJTZWN1cmUgRGlnaXRhbCBDZXJ0aWZp Y2F0ZSBTaWduaW5nMTgwNgYDVQQDEy9TdGFydENvbSBDbGFzcyAxIFByaW1hcnkgSW50ZXJt ZWRpYXRlIENsaWVudCBDQTAeFw0xNTAyMDUwMTUxNDdaFw0xNjAyMDYwMDAzMTNaMEAxGzAZ BgNVBAMMEmRhdmlkQHBvcmtyaW5kLm9yZzEhMB8GCSqGSIb3DQEJARYSZGF2aWRAcG9ya3Jp bmQub3JnMIIBIjANBgkqhkiG9w0BAQEFAAOCAQ8AMIIBCgKCAQEA7HjIR+hHVT+RlXpDQWHt fHToCo718aI00KKtR3fVlcFbFTcrkhZd52HvZvoZPLfV2IkSEMZKEnd3f17iqq5KUXGkvQja 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