From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Paul Eggert Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: A simple solution to "Upcoming loss of usability ..." Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 09:36:53 -0700 Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department Message-ID: <558C2E25.10303@cs.ucla.edu> References: <87egkzg7gb.fsf@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1435250246 13813 80.91.229.3 (25 Jun 2015 16:37:26 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 16:37:26 +0000 (UTC) To: Oleh Krehel , emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Jun 25 18:37:19 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Z8A9O-0003cL-Hz for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 25 Jun 2015 18:37:18 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:56612 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z8A9N-0007dz-R8 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 25 Jun 2015 12:37:17 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:47160) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z8A95-0007dg-Jh for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 25 Jun 2015 12:37:03 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z8A91-0006ox-Mu for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 25 Jun 2015 12:36:59 -0400 Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([131.179.128.68]:55063) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z8A91-0006oY-Gm for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 25 Jun 2015 12:36:55 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 217511601CB; Thu, 25 Jun 2015 09:36:54 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id MhILegmi42ib; Thu, 25 Jun 2015 09:36:53 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6306016085D; Thu, 25 Jun 2015 09:36:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at zimbra.cs.ucla.edu Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id LRsjb3bNCivT; Thu, 25 Jun 2015 09:36:53 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [192.168.1.9] (pool-100-32-155-148.lsanca.fios.verizon.net [100.32.155.148]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 47D24160857; Thu, 25 Jun 2015 09:36:53 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.7.0 In-Reply-To: <87egkzg7gb.fsf@gmail.com> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 131.179.128.68 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:187524 Archived-At: Oleh Krehel wrote: > (font-lock-add-keywords > 'emacs-lisp-mode > '(("\\(`\\)\\([a-zA-Z-0-9]+\\)\\('\\)" The proposed approach would mishandle many cases where the things being q= uoted=20 are not typical Lisp identifiers. E.g.: "Press =E2=80=98h=E2=80=99 for complete help; press =E2=80=98?=E2=80=99 r= epeatedly for a summary" "Make =E2=80=98funcall/apply=E2=80=99 form to map SOURCE-ARGLIST to TARGE= T-ARGLIST...." "... Example: =E2=80=98(ad-map-arglists '(a &rest args) '(w x y z))=E2=80= =99 will return ..." Also, the proposed approach won't easily generalize to diagnostics, which= often=20 quote non-identifiers like =E2=80=98%s=E2=80=99. There's also a UI probl= em: ot would cause=20 action-at-a-distance, because typing an apostrophe in one place in the bu= ffer=20 would visually alter a part of the line many characters away.=20 (Action-at-a-distance is not a fatal objection, but it is better to avoid= it=20 when possible.) Most of the advantages you mention for the proposed approach are also adv= antages=20 of the approach in master. With the current approach, the Emacs sources = don't=20 need to be changed, quotes are just as easy to input (in Electric Quote m= ode),=20 terminal and copy-pasting work, and quotes are markup. The main advantage of the proposed approach over the current master is th= at the=20 source code often can still contain grave accent and apostrophe unmodifie= d, even=20 though people reading and editing the source code will see curved quotes.= To my=20 mind this is more a recipe for confusion than anything else -- at least, = I=20 wouldn't want to inflict it on Emacs newcomers.