From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Jan D." Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [PATCH] About the :distant-foreground face attribute Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2014 10:25:30 +0100 Message-ID: <52D6540A.5000204@swipnet.se> References: <87bnzo9cja.fsf@gnu.org> <59B7E7FC-48D0-4737-B1BB-FFAC5BA9E07A@swipnet.se> <874n5f3162.fsf@gnu.org> <83fvozf86g.fsf@gnu.org> <87r48javwe.fsf@gnu.org> <83bnzmfjxe.fsf@gnu.org> <52D3E689.6050902@dancol.org> <8E16225F-53EF-498A-AB35-66EB9B33B859@swipnet.se> <52D43360.6050605@dancol.org> <9BD01B88-AF13-44DD-8DBE-4598BAC136DD@swipnet.se> <52D45C73.6090906@dancol.org> <52D4EBA9.8050802@swipnet.se> <52D4F2C2.8080800@dancol.org> <52D504A7.80104@swipnet.se> <52D514FF.7010404@dancol.org> <52D52312.6070106@swipnet.se> <52D58632.3010106@dancol.org> <381DEBDC-71D8-4FAC-BA55-897FEC73A2FC@swipnet.se> <52D598AF.9050306@dancol.org> <52D5B6AB.50109@dancol.org> <2BAA45E8-D1C0-4028-89AD-726A10474D11@swipnet.se> <52D64164.7000401@dancol.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1389777968 20080 80.91.229.3 (15 Jan 2014 09:26:08 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2014 09:26:08 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Eli Zaretskii , Chong Yidong , emacs-devel To: Daniel Colascione Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Jan 15 10:26:14 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1W3Mjl-0005CW-Ng for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 10:26:13 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:53194 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W3Mjl-0002y1-8W for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 04:26:13 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:38408) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W3Mja-0002r2-G0 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 04:26:10 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W3MjS-00087e-DG for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 04:26:02 -0500 Original-Received: from mailfe07.swip.net ([212.247.154.193]:35620 helo=swip.net) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W3MjB-00085W-71; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 04:25:37 -0500 X-T2-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50 Original-Received: from hosdjarv.se (account mj138573@tele2.se [46.59.42.57] verified) by mailfe07.swip.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4.4) with ESMTPA id 468391870; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 10:25:34 +0100 Original-Received: from jdvpro.hq.ismobile.com (unknown [176.57.193.190]) (Authenticated sender: jhd) by hosdjarv.se (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id CB2201A00FB; Wed, 15 Jan 2014 09:25:33 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.9; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130328 Thunderbird/17.0.5 In-Reply-To: <52D64164.7000401@dancol.org> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 212.247.154.193 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:168448 Archived-At: Daniel Colascione skrev 2014-01-15 09:05: > On 01/14/2014 10:33 PM, Jan Djärv wrote: >> I have stated my justification as such: User and system >> configurations should override Emacs settings and code in the default >> case, i.e. when the user has made no explicit customization in >> Emacs. > > You haven't stated any justification at all. All you've done is > re-assert your position. And my position is what I say above. > You clearly think it's okay for Emacs to > override the foreground selection color in some circumstances, otherwise > you'd support keeping the 24.3 behavior. Yes I do, otherwise I wouldn't have fixed the bug report. > You're justifying your > particular strategy for handling contrast inherent in the new behavior > by invoking a principle you *JUST VIOLATED* by creating the problematic > new behavior. No need to shout. There is no behaviour that is problematic AFAIK, you are objecting on basis of design, not because the behaviour of letting font lock faces shine through is problematic in some way. I did not violate the principle by this code. As I said, when there is a choice between system/user defined color and generated colors, the first should be preferred. This does not in any way imply that user/system colors shall always be used in all circumstances they might be used. For example if we show font-lock foreground and selection background we are not considering user/system color for the foreground because we are providing a feature (font-lock) where system color is not applicable. There exists a default font size for text in the system also. We are using that by default. But info makes headers in a larger font size. This does not mean that we have overridden the system font size, and are violating the principle of using system font size. It is a totally separate feature where system font size is not applicable. And so is the case of marking font-locked text. > > We have to do something about contrast problems. Why do you think your > solution produces better results than mine? As I said before "better" is subjective, and from my point of view, it has nothing to do with "better". > If, to render something the > user can actually read, we have to choose a foreground color other than > what normal face logic would produce, why use the system selection > foreground color instead of some other color we algorithmically create? > > Please don't invoke the "system settings should override Emacs" crap > again: that idea clearly doesn't hold in the case we're talking about. Yes it does. Jan D.