From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?ISO-8859-15?Q?Andreas_R=F6hler?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: A proposal (ox-html.el/ox-odt.el) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 09:08:16 +0100 Message-ID: <514033F0.8000201@online.de> References: <87ober717z.fsf@gmail.com> <87mwu9iwcp.fsf@gmail.com> <87mwu9fiu0.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <878v5tyw4c.fsf_-_@gmail.com> <87ppz4r1pu.fsf@riseup.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1363163887 25681 80.91.229.3 (13 Mar 2013 08:38:07 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 08:38:07 +0000 (UTC) Cc: "Thomas S. Dye" To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Mar 13 09:38:32 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1UFhCg-0006Lf-Mv for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 13 Mar 2013 09:38:30 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:36486 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UFhCK-0008TR-Bf for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 13 Mar 2013 04:38:08 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:35392) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UFgik-0007HJ-9t for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Mar 2013 04:07:36 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UFgif-0003M0-Mm for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Mar 2013 04:07:34 -0400 Original-Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de ([212.227.17.10]:64930) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1UFgif-0003Ln-E4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Mar 2013 04:07:29 -0400 Original-Received: from [192.168.178.21] (brln-4dbc74b1.pool.mediaWays.net [77.188.116.177]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mreu0) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0MCdVO-1UP06j450k-009RJ1; Wed, 13 Mar 2013 09:07:24 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130215 Thunderbird/17.0.3 In-Reply-To: X-Provags-ID: V02:K0:4EWmKoCmxgXA0jJDOnlf4qoSAeldUc0TTQoy1SPmXsl IJx5tSpLMArtAR2S+P0S029zyTdipH6xCa86zZWsBAi3pnu3Mp jKBJPfFOkAIx39Alj8hJ/nvVOsz5oA7Xw2dinYq7KecaOONrRj ZRCm4cfhQFVjHhKpbYIFvRYxs+MSrDRB4pExj4g8Rn11H1dWva dvHB6xESgKoK2+jmn6L3aavsodsABwJ1wnLc3csZqtK+Y9Lyi5 quXDi1bWIaqiJDJzwLKJYD5+Cfv37eQTjQJyxENKK2ojNobH6e 2fa5S2DWHsjnjg79ZWkE2iTxdTxtOP56y3i9IT2LCsCIvyDG4K 7HjgzfBtF7b4dH9+T12Uh8HRR1IA7R7p/t3QFBWeu X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.4.x-2.6.x [generic] X-Received-From: 212.227.17.10 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:157816 Archived-At: Am 12.03.2013 19:38, schrieb Thomas S. Dye: > > > Aloha all, > > wgreenhouse-sGOZH3hwPm2sTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org (W. Greenhouse) > writes: > >> Jambunathan, >> >> Jambunathan K writes: >> >>> People are disregarding my "moral rights" over my work and pushing me in >>> a corner to act a certain way to serve their own interests. This I feel >>> is plain wrong and an act of snatching or appropriation. >>> >>> Jambunathan K. >> >> Moral right and copyright are unrelated concepts. In the jurisdictions >> that recognize "author's moral right" or "droit moral" (much of the EU >> and other civil-code countries), such right is non-assignable and would >> not even be affected by the FSF papers. However, in the jurisdictions >> where copyright is assignable, it has nothing to do with author's moral >> right. >> >> If we're going to discuss "moral right" in the less legalistic and more >> broad sense of your rights in an ethical society as a person with >> agency, I think you're disregarding the rights of prior contributors to >> the ox-html program, of which you were but one of many. Those >> contributors did intend the code to become part of Emacs, and, morally >> as well as legally, you entered into an agreement to further that aim >> when you decided to work on it. If you really do intend to take your >> ball and go home, do please call a fork a fork--and also do please >> recognize that you are the one "snatching" or "appropriating" a joint >> work out of your own sense of pique. >> >>> I want to fork ox-html.el and ox-odt.el (as it stands today in Org repo) >>> to GNU ELPA repo. I request that Emacs maintainers recognize the GNU >>> ELPA version (maintained by me) as the authoritative official versions >>> of these files that gets bundled with SUMO Emacs. >> >> ... >> >>> >>> Jambunathan >>> +---------------+ >>> | ox-html.el +--- push Emacs maintainer >>> | ox-odt.el | \----- >>> | GNU ELPA | \----- +--------------------+ >>> | | \-->| | >>> +---------------+ | lisp/org/ox-html.el| >>> ^ Push | lisp/org/ox-odt.el | >>> | | | >>> | +--------------------+ >>> | | Other org files | >>> +------+---------+ /->| | >>> | | /--- | | >>> | Org repo | /---- | | >>> | | /--- +--------------------+ >>> | +-- push >>> | | >>> | | >>> +----------------+ >>> Org maintainer >> >> >> This makes no sense at all. It is needless busywork for the Emacs >> maintainer to integrate code from one particular contributor who is unable >> to cooperate with the maintainer of the project to which he >> contributes. It also unnecessarily inconveniences ordinary Emacs/Org >> users, who would now face a further obstacle to simply using the >> software. They already have to go elsewhere to get contrib/ programs >> or to use the latest version of Org; now you want to make it so that >> even the release version of Org is fractured and schismed. That is >> totally unacceptable. > > If this analysis is correct, then Jambunathan's proposal furthers his > stated purpose "to delay the release [of Org] or cause confusion". > > I am concerned (perhaps out of ignorance) that Jambunathan's ability to > contribute code to Org might be used to the same effect. > > Because I am keen to know that my investment in Org is being suitably > protected, could someone assure me either that my concern is unfounded, > i.e., that code contributed by Jambunathan can be successfully vetted so > that it doesn't delay development or cause confusion, or that > appropriate steps have been taken to ensure that future code > contributions from Jambunathan will not become part of Org? > > All the best, > Tom > Hi Tom, while not being