From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David De La Harpe Golden Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Native scrollbars? [was: visible-bell patch for Mac OS X] Date: Sat, 13 Feb 2010 05:45:21 +0000 Message-ID: <4B763C71.7060807@harpegolden.net> References: <87ljffx7zr.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <87bpg90x1s.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <4B7605BF.10404@harpegolden.net> <873a15x02e.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1266039940 30805 80.91.229.12 (13 Feb 2010 05:45:40 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 13 Feb 2010 05:45:40 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Chong Yidong , Filipe Cabecinhas , YAMAMOTO Mitsuharu , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Feb 13 06:45:36 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NgAox-00058T-MC for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2010 06:45:35 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42614 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NgAox-0007yk-0x for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2010 00:45:35 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NgAoq-0007y8-Ca for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2010 00:45:28 -0500 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=60023 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NgAop-0007xN-A4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2010 00:45:27 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NgAoo-000581-2H for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2010 00:45:27 -0500 Original-Received: from harpegolden.net ([65.99.215.13]:48248) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NgAon-00057u-PY for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 13 Feb 2010 00:45:26 -0500 Original-Received: from [87.198.55.113] (87-198-55-113.ptr.magnet.ie [87.198.55.113]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "David De La Harpe Golden", Issuer "David De La Harpe Golden Personal CA rev 3" (verified OK)) by harpegolden.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D58F8CD2; Sat, 13 Feb 2010 05:45:23 +0000 (GMT) User-Agent: Mozilla-Thunderbird 2.0.0.22 (X11/20091109) In-Reply-To: <873a15x02e.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:121089 Archived-At: Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: > David De La Harpe Golden writes: > > > Emacs could make the scrollbars native and this would make sure > > they weren't overdrawn > [Just to be clear, I was quoting the gtk page, gtk+ guys wrote the above not me ] > I suspect that going to native scrollbars would annoy a lot of users. > I'm not clear that's what the gtk+ guys mean in context by "native", however. That wouldn't make sense in context, because there'd be no gtk+ drawn scrollbars for emacs to stomp on? GNU Emacs indeed has a compile-time choice of "toolkit" (native as you [Stephen T.] mean it) scrollbars, or the emacs-internal ones. The toolkit ones are significantly disliked, yes, however I think they're quite widely used, perhaps unlike the xemacs case. So I think the gtk+/emacs bug may show up (I don't actually see it on my system, but my gtk+ might be too old) with the _toolkit_ scrollbars from the emacs perspective, since emacs thinks they're a child X11 window and thinks it's okay to clear the parent window, which perhaps eats the gtk+ drawn scrollbar which isn't in a separate X11 child window anymore in recent gtk. So I think gtk+ guys mean there's a way for emacs to request gtk to continue to use "native" (real X11 child) windows at the gtk/gdk level: Well, there is a way to do it app-globally- set env var GDK_NATIVE_WINDOWS=1 http://blogs.gurulabs.com/dax/2009/10/what-gdk-native.html I'm not familiar enough with gtk to know if it's possible for emacs to ask for only the gtk+ toolkit scrollbars to be "native" in the sense gtk+ guys seem to mean it, at least based on my current potentially incorrect understanding as above.