From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Thomas Lord Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: MAINTAINERS file Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2008 18:25:29 -0800 Message-ID: <47CF5619.9000704@emf.net> References: <18375.18663.981150.252393@kahikatea.snap.net.nz> <87od9wt19m.fsf@elegiac.orebokech.com> <87tzjnvjhc.fsf@red-bean.com> <87ablffdf7.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <4s4pbm9lrb.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1204764505 8363 80.91.229.12 (6 Mar 2008 00:48:25 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 00:48:25 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Glenn Morris , rms@gnu.org, lekktu@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, kfogel@red-bean.com, paul.r.ml@gmail.com, miles@gnu.org To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Mar 06 01:48:51 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1JX4Hy-0002EF-0q for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 06 Mar 2008 01:48:50 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JX4HQ-0003G9-Kq for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 05 Mar 2008 19:48:16 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JX4HK-0003Fd-J8 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 05 Mar 2008 19:48:10 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JX4HG-0003BI-92 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 05 Mar 2008 19:48:10 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JX4HF-0003Ak-JW for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 05 Mar 2008 19:48:05 -0500 Original-Received: from mail.42inc.com ([205.149.0.25]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (SSL 3.0:RSA_3DES_EDE_CBC_SHA1:24) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1JX4H3-0003nc-Q5; Wed, 05 Mar 2008 19:47:54 -0500 X-TFF-CGPSA-Version: 1.5 X-TFF-CGPSA-Filter-42inc: Scanned X-42-Virus-Scanned: by 42 Antivirus -- Found to be clean. Original-Received: from [69.236.65.4] (account lord@emf.net HELO [192.168.1.64]) by mail.42inc.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.0.13) with ESMTPA id 24645370; Wed, 05 Mar 2008 16:47:30 -0800 User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (X11/20060808) In-Reply-To: X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:91454 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier wrote: > To the extend that (like Arch) Bzr can use just `sftp' to read&write > a remote repository, I guess that there's no need for anything special, > other than a location. Using a subdir of > arch.sv.gnu.org:/archives/emacs will work, but it's ugly. > Just to brag: Arch's "dumb archive" architecture let's an archive be hosted by sftp or ftp: no arch-specific program has to be installed and operated on the server side -- only some commonly available, file-system-style service. Relying on only "dumb servers" was a design constraint from the earliest days of Arch. The constraint was deliberately adopted to achieve a goal: to make it easier for people to "deploy" arch without requiring cooperation from a third party. For example, that sftp is already an option on a host makes it easier to deploy arch on that host, without any change needed from the host operator. It's nice to see that pay off *internally* to the GNU project but that's a happy accident. The original thought was more banal: it's easier and cheaper for people to find themselves an FTP or SFTP host than it is for them to provision a personal host on which to install and operate a version control system server. I was thinking of "basement hackers" who could maybe get a gratis FTP site, but couldn't get a gratis place to install a revision control server that they themselves controlled. Or, at least, an (S)FTP site would be cheaper for a basement hacker. I also worried about the so-called "dissident" problem: piggy-backing on "dumb services" makes it easier for people to publish source code even in circumstances where permission would seek to require yet not offer itself. The original thought was that centralized project sites like Savannah and Sourceforge might fade away (or, rather, morph into more "Freshmeat"-style services). That's part of the reason I'm so flummoxed by "Launchpad," which seems a complete inversion of the original aims of Arch. -t