From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Dmitry Gutov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Contradictiory directions Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2021 16:52:42 +0300 Message-ID: <43940d5d-4c19-5ba8-7a6f-af937a920c81@yandex.ru> References: <87wnk6mjlm.fsf@gnus.org> <877dc6tjz0.fsf_-_@yahoo.com> <87k0g6mivu.fsf@gnus.org> <87y24ms4jj.fsf@yahoo.com> <87fsqumi16.fsf@gnus.org> <87tufas40e.fsf@yahoo.com> <877dc6mhjc.fsf@gnus.org> <87pmpys3gv.fsf@yahoo.com> <8735mumgyy.fsf@gnus.org> <87lf0ms2to.fsf@yahoo.com> <875yrqrydx.fsf@yahoo.com> <7889657a-ba2e-2dbf-9d5e-a793704f7b8c@yandex.ru> <87r1aeoxqk.fsf@yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="24984"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.13.0 Cc: tomas@tuxteam.de, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Po Lu Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Dec 15 15:22:55 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mxVBE-0006KM-W9 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 15 Dec 2021 15:22:53 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:54866 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mxVBD-00065Q-Pz for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 15 Dec 2021 09:22:51 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:40550) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mxUj3-0007eS-37 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 15 Dec 2021 08:53:46 -0500 Original-Received: from [2a00:1450:4864:20::136] (port=40548 helo=mail-lf1-x136.google.com) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mxUj0-00084k-Rx for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 15 Dec 2021 08:53:44 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-lf1-x136.google.com with SMTP id l22so43244821lfg.7 for ; Wed, 15 Dec 2021 05:53:42 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=sender:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=qYdiT0uGO95RSj8FZCPV93hSni9pwgUPnAhass/8AXM=; b=cDK1AvWbx2XgcEJnGQdcZ3dXl+ARW7Us12KEGiZoT67+2++kbymSp0p9BdVLFruKz5 IPSUZmW6BIZizvWwl4gEdUGG86QAyusLFvPUWD4fJFG+n1SOGabFYeoA9SOl4PUPobdi tatbIrf2ZrixR8rZnNOz0Zb/obfpSSAvX/L+VrrCvffU1bMpH7kUiOX9L84QAjPCawYX 6OzSazV5G1Z9VkxBdZgdSr7uE7YgbLjObNLfzMVg3AosWZ7IDE20Qw9x8urdCmI2gER4 VuuR88qel7mMeR+UBNW5q8KJcliUzfAFAlP6SymY2uVTq5RkYkaWx8jhuOqKhXWG9myd 3wvg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id :date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=qYdiT0uGO95RSj8FZCPV93hSni9pwgUPnAhass/8AXM=; b=FJrFFgi9tEjUjOJdWXtKZJtet/cigxWOmgOgvugUwWVJsvLusAb0CEgkwbY4FbSlaD /Sk4uNsWCREn//xeQVsDwnrS2cu5UO+wogd4eShJT+JjV6aBNTXRUqUyFVagxFo9Cqzy MZ+oqY4nwBl23fn4PsbGkD3cpXzT1Fff9S6U0wO079T5i71FEE9STkkU1wE3S213uDG7 2wR0WubUyeQgq5t1lZMYYOi4F4EQGeDh/5RqWoavqTSDENhVIE34UHZQbbVf5qVPpgjz vi2bofGNfluJ/XtXWAoq42iYhO9JUFRkfbWXfzTY1+hGYnd/55nlgNafYWZIKVrXE0vv zCtQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533eWQuWLVJzjq55YE2jsxkJ4uKE8F0E2hhe8csgmu7ZUBAXoryB Cux2pg02NleDKY4xjjXQXcOSsdIRF5Q= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwYAjkZ682QOiH1mXVbj2Dw0g1NEf5wDwKHywxTce3wy56p0LRipOuDipT4xHqvq24X/cEStg== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6512:aca:: with SMTP id n10mr10069997lfu.265.1639576420950; Wed, 15 Dec 2021 05:53:40 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from [192.168.0.103] ([5.18.233.185]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id q18sm332245lfu.74.2021.12.15.05.53.40 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 15 Dec 2021 05:53:40 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <87r1aeoxqk.fsf@yahoo.com> Content-Language: en-US X-Host-Lookup-Failed: Reverse DNS lookup failed for 2a00:1450:4864:20::136 (failed) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::136; envelope-from=raaahh@gmail.com; helo=mail-lf1-x136.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -22 X-Spam_score: -2.3 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.3 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.249, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, NICE_REPLY_A=-1.64, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:282043 Archived-At: On 15.12.2021 15:31, Po Lu wrote: > Dmitry Gutov writes: > >> It's a discussion where one side is aware of the political >> connotations of the terms and the reasons why "the world has moved on >> from them", and another stays willfully ignorant of them. > > Either way, I did not start a discussion about politics, so please don't > turn it into one. You started to ask questions which are easily answered by doing some research (via searching the web) outside of this mailing list. There is indeed little point in rehashing this argument which has occurred in a myriad of places by now. > Would you accept a change from "window" to "glass sheet", especially if > "window" will still be used inside Emacs in many places? Irrelevant. > Developing software is hard enough, so please try not to make it even > more confusing with sudden (and partial) changes in terminology. There is nothing confusing in "allowlist" and "denylist". Those are plain English. FWIW, personally I'm in no hurry to move on from "white/black" and "master/slave" in all my projects across the board, but it's clear by now that such a move must occur eventually. So arguing about undoing such changes that have already been made is counter-productive.