From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Gregory Heytings Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Stepping Back: A Wealth Of Completion systems Re: [ELPA] New package: vertico Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2021 15:24:11 +0000 Message-ID: <3ec7e2e58a3f78988f11@heytings.org> References: <9c9af088-580f-9fb1-4d79-237a74ce605c@inventati.org> <874kgkxxs0.fsf@posteo.net> <3ec7e2e58a100426a22e@heytings.org> <877dleb2px.fsf@posteo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="24397"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Philip Kaludercic Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Apr 07 17:24:54 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lUA32-0006DR-Rp for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 07 Apr 2021 17:24:52 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38532 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lUA31-00066L-Qc for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 07 Apr 2021 11:24:51 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:33042) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lUA2U-0005gN-2u for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 07 Apr 2021 11:24:18 -0400 Original-Received: from heytings.org ([95.142.160.155]:60802) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lUA2Q-00019S-NA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 07 Apr 2021 11:24:17 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=heytings.org; s=20210101; t=1617809051; bh=mwHpX2jIDJQQLGHHWQtYirNCPMboxRaUNLKSw66a4Cc=; h=Date:From:To:cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:References:From; b=immye10ODCMjYh8XC3KgBgzZNYVls/GT0UwnlbosCk0XjAxvEzksHoeT4n4Gf9aDT 9ps9OvQ2qdGXp0AaqqjQQZus9O1GG+3b4GZCrgfUUif2C/4AK2O8TPqVniG716FVGO kOB6YjaGDHWxWzEekRugs6LrCIyBLzWNqjODnGuuvBzCoUOVjLR3+hVSEyVGysCQA0 VFXUhcaa1B+mF1ob7TohuHb7yiq/YpbXlL3zI92v60W6KKH/msW7Qsf0He8PBBky5J /s/8T/v0QmOhGlm8nd1G63Dry4bgC8M7AAypLwkJev60lfMO2IVBQ4uTi5poamRFPz Nl9AZz8mSILAQ== In-Reply-To: <877dleb2px.fsf@posteo.net> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=95.142.160.155; envelope-from=gregory@heytings.org; helo=heytings.org X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:267526 Archived-At: >> I've been thinking about this, and I'm not sure I understand what the >> real difference between "completing" and "selecting" is. Do I >> understand correctly that the difference is between, for example, >> expanding command names (completing), and choosing an emoji in a list >> (selecting)? > > I think the main difference is in the UI. The default completion UI for > Emacs will expand text in-place. M-x tdoe becomes > toggle-debug-on-error, with the initials style. This appears to make > sense for well structured text, such as commands or files. > > Selection are probably situations where you want more visual feedback, > and it would make sense to present a list/tree by default. I don't think > that this has to be strictly about text. > > Generally speaking, you can complete the textual representation of > anything or select the object themselves. I don't think that either is > always better, but I think we can do better than selecting textual > representations. > Okay, I think I understand your viewpoint (a bit) better now. But: 1. It seems to me that the UI you have in mind is closer to 'transient' than to 'completing-read'. 2. That UI already exists to some extent in Emacs, for example dired, imenu (either in the menu bar or bound to a mouse event), ibuffer, the speedbar, ... 3. Such a UI probably wouln't fit in the (by definition) limited space of a minibuffer.