From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ivan Andrus Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs learning curve Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2010 14:53:44 +0200 Message-ID: <38C9C0BC-5110-4E24-BB49-48F114557C52@gmail.com> References: <4C3B6A8A.80105@gmx.de> <201007221516.17432.tassilo@member.fsf.org> <770DFAD9-23D5-4BD3-A209-7E64FFC8999C@gmail.com> <201007230857.48161.tassilo@member.fsf.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1081) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1279890110 26290 80.91.229.12 (23 Jul 2010 13:01:50 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2010 13:01:50 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Tassilo Horn Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jul 23 15:01:49 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OcHrL-0006pM-Mt for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 23 Jul 2010 15:01:47 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51558 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OcHr3-0001iL-9k for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 23 Jul 2010 08:59:57 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=41873 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OcHqt-0001Yf-Rq for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Jul 2010 08:59:49 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OcHl7-00065i-Bu for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Jul 2010 08:53:50 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-fx0-f41.google.com ([209.85.161.41]:56314) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OcHl7-00065Z-7Y for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Jul 2010 08:53:49 -0400 Original-Received: by fxm20 with SMTP id 20so5570526fxm.0 for ; Fri, 23 Jul 2010 05:53:48 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:subject:mime-version :content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:content-transfer-encoding :message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=Ao9h+Zm3B54KEm0WzxswbLDL6XxwIjsEa6AgJntsKrU=; b=Pq97duIU+PUnU8X1k7YfVGTi8U1hMM2wqMCDbTwCTJoRQoeR4QRd1D/43on3G79BK7 tMZjtfCMjm60wkz1x29vsPDLDSzBEII9VEu/CX6QscgwvojcgbLE4bib4BrbCT0oyGu6 9wfmYByV2+hFANJioiKS0njZ4Ezhbdd7Gb870= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer; b=jD80mhSQUTvC/XNJueLg+nQxfZiLl4/lwQY/BvojKO36CdfoNNcX3XVDHUmXfhi1qV 0ujBY33aT+Uj1U3nMAh8UAVdkDbBR7alNvBHNnBZx0+GUxQBeXuSHw3cbpuutIxB1txh st0wsOqHDU2HlJ2x+rkB6F1OBeW+Nw0V09Lnc= Original-Received: by 10.86.66.4 with SMTP id o4mr2662393fga.56.1279889628223; Fri, 23 Jul 2010 05:53:48 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [192.168.1.104] (catv-89-134-157-224.catv.broadband.hu [89.134.157.224]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id c5sm76915fac.43.2010.07.23.05.53.45 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Fri, 23 Jul 2010 05:53:47 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <201007230857.48161.tassilo@member.fsf.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1081) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:127695 Archived-At: Oops, I had meant to send the original to the list. On Jul 23, 2010, at 8:57 AM, Tassilo Horn wrote: > On Thursday 22 July 2010 22:33:16 Ivan Andrus wrote: >=20 >>> No, but at least it's true for me. There's some mode that records >>> key / command frequencies. Use it for a while and see how tiny the >>> command fraction is compared to `self-insert-command'. Then add >>> some time for thinking before writing to the calculation, and you'll >>> see that the time needed for typing command key bindings is totally >>> out of relevance. >=20 > I have to admit that this suggestion was made out of a gut-feeling. = So > now, I got and enabled command-frequency.el, too. Currently, here're > the results of my first 5 minutes (only reading mail/news and replying > to you): >=20 > 241 45.99% self-insert-command > 116 22.14% gnus-summary-scroll-up > 36 6.87% next-line > 22 4.20% delete-backward-char > 20 3.82% kill-line > 16 3.05% gnus-summary-catchup-and-exit > 16 3.05% gnus-topic-select-group > 11 2.10% previous-line > 6 1.15% minibuffer-complete > ... >=20 >> I must say that I was shocked myself when I looked at it. I thought >> self-insert-command would be 50-60% for me, but apparently I do even >> less typing than I thought (though my usage recently has been a bit >> that way): >>=20 >> 7651 21.06% self-insert-command >> 4475 12.31% next-line >> 2756 7.58% previous-line >> 1124 3.09% org-self-insert-command >> ... >>=20 >> I wonder what others see. >=20 > I think it could be a benefit to revamp this package so that it sends > statistics to some server. In addition, it should record how a = command > was executed (M-x, or with ) and in which minor/major mode. That > would allow spotting frequently used commands with non-ergonomic > bindings. I completely agree. > At least the tops of our statistics are all accessible with one key > (with or without modifier). Indeed. And I think that's the most important thing. Of course we = might use them more _because_ they have simple key bindings. -Ivan=