* dropped 4th arg from all-completions
@ 2010-04-27 16:01 Drew Adams
2010-04-27 18:12 ` Stefan Monnier
0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Drew Adams @ 2010-04-27 16:01 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: emacs-devel
I object to Emacs 23.2 dropping the 4th arg from `all-completions'.
I do not understand why the feature of ignoring candidates that start with a
space was removed. It is an optional arg - no call is forced to use it.
FWIW, I use this 4th arg. I even have a user option and a minibuffer toggle key
that lets users control the removal of such candidates. If you don't want to use
the feature, that's one thing, but why remove it from Emacs?
AFAIK there was no proposal to drop the 4th arg, no discussion here. If similar
things have also been done elsewhere, I have the same objection. This is not the
right way.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: dropped 4th arg from all-completions
2010-04-27 16:01 dropped 4th arg from all-completions Drew Adams
@ 2010-04-27 18:12 ` Stefan Monnier
2010-04-27 20:27 ` Drew Adams
0 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Stefan Monnier @ 2010-04-27 18:12 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Drew Adams; +Cc: emacs-devel
> I object to Emacs 23.2 dropping the 4th arg from `all-completions'.
My 23.2 code shows all-completions accepts 4 args.
Heck, even the 24 branch still accepts 4 args.
> I do not understand why the feature of ignoring candidates that start
> with a space was removed.
It doesn't have its place in `all-completions' (which is an internal
function, and hence not directly related to any UI feature).
> FWIW, I use this 4th arg. I even have a user option and a minibuffer
> toggle key that lets users control the removal of such candidates.
> If you don't want to use the feature, that's one thing, but why remove
> it from Emacs?
You can get the same result by changing the completion table instead, or
by changing the `predicate'. These approaches also have the advantage
of being a lot more flexible.
Stefan
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread* RE: dropped 4th arg from all-completions
2010-04-27 18:12 ` Stefan Monnier
@ 2010-04-27 20:27 ` Drew Adams
2010-04-27 21:44 ` Chong Yidong
2010-04-28 4:09 ` Stefan Monnier
0 siblings, 2 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Drew Adams @ 2010-04-27 20:27 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: 'Stefan Monnier'; +Cc: emacs-devel
> > I object to Emacs 23.2 dropping the 4th arg from `all-completions'.
>
> My 23.2 code shows all-completions accepts 4 args.
> Heck, even the 24 branch still accepts 4 args.
Your "acceptance" is hollow - bad faith. Emacs does not raise an error, but it
does not respect the arg. You have broken any code that uses a non-nil 4th arg.
And the doc shows only 3 args, and the byte compiler warns about #4.
> > I do not understand why the feature of ignoring candidates
> > that start with a space was removed.
>
> It doesn't have its place in `all-completions' (which is an internal
> function, and hence not directly related to any UI feature).
I disagree that it is an internal function.
> > FWIW, I use this 4th arg. I even have a user option and a
> > minibuffer toggle key that lets users control the removal
> > of such candidates. If you don't want to use the feature,
> > that's one thing, but why remove it from Emacs?
>
> You can get the same result by changing the completion table
> instead, or by changing the `predicate'. These approaches
> also have the advantage of being a lot more flexible.
My code works with multiple versions of Emacs. There is no reason that
`all-completions' cannot continue to support this argument. It has worked and
been used by Emacs users since Day One.
No proposal for the change. *No reason* given. No discussion.
When will you change the name from Emacs to Monnier?
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: dropped 4th arg from all-completions
2010-04-27 20:27 ` Drew Adams
@ 2010-04-27 21:44 ` Chong Yidong
2010-04-27 22:02 ` Drew Adams
2010-04-28 4:09 ` Stefan Monnier
1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Chong Yidong @ 2010-04-27 21:44 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Drew Adams; +Cc: 'Stefan Monnier', emacs-devel
"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:
>> My 23.2 code shows all-completions accepts 4 args.
>> Heck, even the 24 branch still accepts 4 args.
>
> Your "acceptance" is hollow - bad faith. Emacs does not raise an
> error, but it does not respect the arg.
(all-completions "" '(" asdfgh") nil nil)
=> (" asdf")
(all-completions "" '(" asdfgh") nil t)
=> nil
> And the doc shows only 3 args, and the byte compiler warns about #4.
The byte compiler warns, but the code still works.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread* RE: dropped 4th arg from all-completions
2010-04-27 21:44 ` Chong Yidong
@ 2010-04-27 22:02 ` Drew Adams
0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Drew Adams @ 2010-04-27 22:02 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: 'Chong Yidong'; +Cc: 'Stefan Monnier', emacs-devel
> > Emacs does not raise an error, but it does not respect the arg.
>
> (all-completions "" '(" asdfgh") nil nil)
> => (" asdf")
>
> (all-completions "" '(" asdfgh") nil t)
> => nil
Mille excuses for that part. I apparently checked only with a string that starts
with a space, which is the exceptional case where matching occurs anyway
("ignored unless STRING itself starts with a space"):
(all-completions " abc" '((" abc") ("a")) nil t)
=> (" abc")
That doesn't change the rest, but I'm glad this is still supported under the
covers.
The 4th arg should not be deprecated and it should be documented normally. And
changes like this should not be made with no proposal, no reasons given (still
the case), and no discussion.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: dropped 4th arg from all-completions
2010-04-27 20:27 ` Drew Adams
2010-04-27 21:44 ` Chong Yidong
@ 2010-04-28 4:09 ` Stefan Monnier
2010-04-28 4:29 ` Jay Belanger
1 sibling, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Stefan Monnier @ 2010-04-28 4:09 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Drew Adams; +Cc: emacs-devel
> Your "acceptance" is hollow - bad faith. Emacs does not raise an
> error, but it does not respect the arg.
IIRC That would be a bug. Please provide a recipe.
>> > I do not understand why the feature of ignoring candidates
>> > that start with a space was removed.
>> It doesn't have its place in `all-completions' (which is an internal
>> function, and hence not directly related to any UI feature).
> I disagree that it is an internal function.
Internal in the sense that it's used by completion code to provide the
UI, so its effect does not directly affect the end user.
> No proposal for the change. *No reason* given. No discussion.
AFAIK it was introduced for buffer completion and just happened to have
pretty much no effect on other forms of completions (because completion
candidates that start with a space are extremely rare). Nowadays,
buffer completion provides the same feature in a different way, so this
arg ends up being completely unused.
In any case, I did give you the reason in the previous message:
You can get the same result by changing the completion table instead, or
by changing the `predicate'. These approaches also have the advantage
of being a lot more flexible.
And indeed AFAIK it's completely unused inside Emacs right now (and was
barely used, in an inconsistent way, and mostly by accident only) in
versions before I messed with it.
> When will you change the name from Emacs to Monnier?
Any time now,
Stefan
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2010-04-28 16:53 UTC | newest]
Thread overview: 11+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2010-04-27 16:01 dropped 4th arg from all-completions Drew Adams
2010-04-27 18:12 ` Stefan Monnier
2010-04-27 20:27 ` Drew Adams
2010-04-27 21:44 ` Chong Yidong
2010-04-27 22:02 ` Drew Adams
2010-04-28 4:09 ` Stefan Monnier
2010-04-28 4:29 ` Jay Belanger
2010-04-28 5:13 ` David Kastrup
2010-04-28 14:20 ` Stefan Monnier
2010-04-28 16:53 ` Jay Belanger
2010-04-28 6:53 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
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