From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Alan Mackenzie Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [ELPA] New package: transient Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2020 11:51:08 +0000 Message-ID: <20200430115108.GA4287@ACM> References: <87v9ljo5d0.fsf@bernoul.li> <87ftcnxu5m.fsf@bernoul.li> <83y2qezlpd.fsf@gnu.org> <83tv12zjx1.fsf@gnu.org> <20200429172739.GB4002@ACM> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="17845"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Jonas Bernoulli , Emacs developers , Stefan Monnier , Adam Porter , Eli Zaretskii , Kyle Meyer To: Philippe Vaucher Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Apr 30 13:51:58 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jU7jR-0004Vo-Ml for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 13:51:57 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:58796 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jU7jQ-0002Y3-IR for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 07:51:56 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:33532) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jU7ij-0001OX-Ob for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 07:51:14 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jU7ii-0007pD-OW for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 07:51:13 -0400 Original-Received: from colin.muc.de ([193.149.48.1]:49301 helo=mail.muc.de) by eggs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jU7ii-0007oy-5z for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 07:51:12 -0400 Original-Received: (qmail 2199 invoked by uid 3782); 30 Apr 2020 11:51:09 -0000 Original-Received: from acm.muc.de (p4FE15A0A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [79.225.90.10]) by localhost.muc.de (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Thu, 30 Apr 2020 13:51:08 +0200 Original-Received: (qmail 4380 invoked by uid 1000); 30 Apr 2020 11:51:08 -0000 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.1.12 (Macallan) X-Primary-Address: acm@muc.de Received-SPF: pass client-ip=193.149.48.1; envelope-from=acm@muc.de; helo=mail.muc.de X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/04/30 07:51:10 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = FreeBSD 9.x or newer [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 193.149.48.1 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:248222 Archived-At: Hello, Philippe. On Wed, Apr 29, 2020 at 21:31:46 +0200, Philippe Vaucher wrote: > > > You miss the central point of my argument. The problem is not that the > > > doc is hard to find, it's that I *have* to find it to know which > > > are the related functions. > > Let me put it to you that there is NO PROBLEM here. If you, for any > > reason, forget the function name `assq' you can find it within seconds > > by typing i alist in the manual. And if you don't like reading > > documentation, why make that everybody else's problem? > I suggest you go out an take a deep breathe. Your tone is extremely > unpleasant, and remember that I was asked to clarify what I meant so I did. Thanks for reacting to my post. > At no point am I suggesting this is mandatory and that everyone should do > like I say. [ .... ] > I never talk about replacements. In another post on this thread, you wrote: > Yes, and given we can make aliases to the old names we don't break > backward compatibility, and we can reasonably easily write something > that converts existing code to the new names, and eventually deprecate > the old names :-) That looks strongly to me about replacements. And note you used the verb form "can" rather than the more gentle, conditional form "could". I don't see anything but a desired compulsion implied by that paragraph. There has not yet been a discussion about whether your proposed change is a good idea or not. I am suggesting, strongly, it is not. [ .... ] > I understand I apparently touched a nexus by discussing this and having > some people agree with me, but if you are not able to discuss this in an > open manner I suggest you refrain from discussing it at all. > Kind regards, > Philippe -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).