From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ergus Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Question about display engine Date: Mon, 19 Aug 2019 23:30:24 +0200 Message-ID: <20190819213024.ciukp34xmgrzh7yn@Ergus> References: <83k1bhrsji.fsf@gnu.org> <6f3161f8-b007-ae1c-881e-1fad88348146@gmx.at> <83woffrd7p.fsf@gnu.org> <8336i2qwxj.fsf@gnu.org> <020947f5-a8ab-79de-cf74-9dce4cb1572e@gmx.at> <838srtpkyp.fsf@gnu.org> <471528b0-4749-1dee-3be1-fa18a0203cc7@gmx.at> <20190819161305.uwlgsm44yjrmul3o@Ergus> <83pnl1kskj.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="231854"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" User-Agent: NeoMutt/20180716 Cc: rudalics@gmx.at, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Aug 19 23:30:47 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1hzpEk-000y92-GA for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 19 Aug 2019 23:30:46 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:57988 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1hzpEj-0007ZN-5x for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 19 Aug 2019 17:30:45 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:57397) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1hzpEY-0007Sm-G0 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 19 Aug 2019 17:30:35 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hzpEW-0003sd-5o for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 19 Aug 2019 17:30:33 -0400 Original-Received: from sonic304-23.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com ([77.238.179.148]:39884) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1hzpEW-0003sA-0J for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 19 Aug 2019 17:30:32 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=aol.com; s=a2048; t=1566250229; bh=imESVJmVkqmvlXEVHG2yy2BdgbLNoZsIed/6BgTIgnY=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:From:Subject; b=q9u1UZ6irNEXE8/o9iWt6tMkIQJNicBTbgPACz+oWQFlbxSicGtd8xBz5mNVosTV3Vq4F2lac4ZWqP+3uk7Kh+6mkQdL94LCW33Ulrbt8t0ijNX2967fXediEMOWe1hnuqQbYS83xTlkidNyY0kh5V60tNNI54TWsFwGQ0hBbSUuS9jEW3piGCzvqQQuvOYeL7VFDsPv1cUmIpWZDhFTxloouDo/MyZYt1dagj4OKr+jpxxpY+q8BPeTa7sCqEOC8J1W1ikiSRItSSLm87XnSNjqgDqFIKPdKJH3Kar86B7IDPU+B1Hrcs4lFNyOhuBIk+dkEtrlMLGF1IzWbe6opQ== X-YMail-OSG: d2sw5dEVM1mVJcj_syn3MhbikdN2kkzNyDEL4Z7IG5UeoyeKqowM6S4.31dUdFn q7QBqbtVOHhu4bKg7oQ0w6y5HyQhpUTtMzVJn8dmT42MCmwwXNwUL33Aek90ENlnr0AcGYXdaoxF vApjImub2umXY8iKoMsRsodqlD6EsnEe8QdvKguPv6K1Zql9s4ny9Icbm00vns6V6f04iosKrnBk VwfK_sAxO6yv41ls7FOKo1Nh1pdxRl2I..SYsCigxCtZB88Al1EfUveLBjqlmk1Irt.51Fg8a9Oh 280Ecl6dRQy_hOHOb4EDkUUANPiEoz8egYj_ztEPIcJTdA_StHIQ5.IW2s.KFI_7I2W41StbSywa n1aoSulrfLrLn6ei1ZeFUddzVtjrZxrIkg9ahRkhV18CBd_V3ySFAZ4R6AHWcz2Deag2sLb.XAaR Q6kCsbfTWibzZWyPH6ZHkHKyizLBIcs00H31bLaIdkSVZj8NrPRYb7DkiZvzDvGKDJ2kRNkQ3cKq HxXhTS9DzervgibqygR2QxthqLLCSdma9nxm5YzOVh_4eh_VS.TARrg8ZG7fqGgxRJ6sK8HQ54ET vk4m223OMTXpQrGgy9Zj9TWIEy6Imv2L.npOapQPJHfG4EaFV3gxyco2vTwakd_Fy6Z5l_.tDgN7 zsjm17iUO0k2G.5F.6YkjQbaEtceC8O4Ca9kiOLewCg5w71UjYhQxHU_KxixGCaqcKin0dnybJPh yLB9mI6m3gdmKiW3uqBZ7ccryS1XwQwgXTRUH8QofJ_hQmnA9rhab0AneZYZxDx9DTU9WzmclJDh IkKXAMeulonmeJJ2GxW_psJ2oLaHF7FZm6f7rQyRkE Original-Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic304.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Mon, 19 Aug 2019 21:30:29 +0000 Original-Received: by smtp408.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 9f68602f997a51daadd035ee87be7e56; Mon, 19 Aug 2019 21:30:27 +0000 (UTC) Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <83pnl1kskj.fsf@gnu.org> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 77.238.179.148 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:239470 Archived-At: On Mon, Aug 19, 2019 at 07:50:36PM +0300, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> Date: Mon, 19 Aug 2019 18:13:05 +0200 >> From: Ergus >> Cc: Eli Zaretskii , emacs-devel@gnu.org >> >> Extending the face is a detail that most users won't even notice a >> change while it works somehow. Actually we have had different behaviors >> between gui and tui for years and nobody complained up to now. > >I think you over-simplify the situation. First, both GUI and TTY >frames behave the same when extension of face background color is >concerned, they only differ in how they handle extension of other >attributes (of which only the underline is relevant to TTY frames). >(And I did hear over the years a couple of complaints about how TTY >frames extend the underline attribute.) > >And second, I refer you to the renewed discussion of bug#15934 a day >or two ago, from which my take is that users will notice and do care >about such changes in at least a couple of important use cases, as a >soon-to-be-pushed changes will prove. So I don't think we can change >this behavior at will on the assumption that "no one will notice". > Hi Eli: If soon-to-be-pushed means that you have had already some time to work on this and it will be fixed before emacs 27 then I'll be happy with that (I'll be allowed to fix the dfci issue). I was actually wondering if the discussion was not going anywhere as I didn't see any comment in a couple of days. Unrelated with this I wanted to ask you if you think we should continue with the indentation highlight implementation... because that discussion never ended. Or you think it does not worth the effort. I have seen that elpy already have something like what we want to implement in the lisp level. So they will actually switch for sure to ours if available. What do you think? >> I am wondering about over-specifications and over-engineering for such a >> detail, when most of the users only need to extend the background color. > >This discussion established that even supporting just the background >color non-extension as a user option will require to have almost all >of the machinery in place: the extend bit, the generation of a special >face without the background color, etc. And once we have that, adding >other face attributes to the soup is relatively easy and won't require >any design changes. >