From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Alan Mackenzie Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: `isearch-allow-scroll' - a misnomer and a bad design Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2011 09:04:06 +0000 Message-ID: <20110921090406.GA2537@acm.acm> References: <8739g0vyuy.fsf@mail.jurta.org> <4E6FF63A.4070604@gmail.com> <2F1337889F394491BA778ACA46799812@us.oracle.com> <874o07m3ay.fsf@maru.md5i.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1316596106 6234 80.91.229.12 (21 Sep 2011 09:08:26 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2011 09:08:26 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Michael Welsh Duggan , dan.colascione@gmail.com, rms@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org, juri@jurta.org, chad , drew.adams@oracle.com To: Dani Moncayo Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Sep 21 11:08:19 2011 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([140.186.70.17]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R6Imw-0008UM-DJ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 21 Sep 2011 11:08:18 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38178 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R6Imv-00023W-K0 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 21 Sep 2011 05:08:17 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:43932) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R6Imt-00022m-CB for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 21 Sep 2011 05:08:16 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R6Imr-0006lr-6m for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 21 Sep 2011 05:08:15 -0400 Original-Received: from colin.muc.de ([193.149.48.1]:33735 helo=mail.muc.de) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R6Imq-0006kb-UW for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 21 Sep 2011 05:08:13 -0400 Original-Received: (qmail 14585 invoked by uid 3782); 21 Sep 2011 09:08:11 -0000 Original-Received: from acm.muc.de (pD951BDEA.dip.t-dialin.net [217.81.189.234]) by colin.muc.de (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Wed, 21 Sep 2011 11:08:06 +0200 Original-Received: (qmail 2772 invoked by uid 1000); 21 Sep 2011 09:04:06 -0000 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.1.12 (Macallan) X-Primary-Address: acm@muc.de X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 193.149.48.1 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:144142 Archived-At: Hi, everybody. On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at 09:59:22PM +0200, Dani Moncayo wrote: > > Since C-u is always a prefix character, would it make sense to you for > > it not to quit isearch if the character that follows a C-u opt/number > > prefix is a key sequence that is currently in use by isearch, and for it > > to quit Isearch and pass the prefix on to the non-isearch command > > otherwise? > > In this case, `C-u C-n' would exit isearch and move down 4 lines, whereas > > `C-u n' would add four "n"s to the current search string. Since when has adding four identical characters into a search string been useful? Maybe "))))" whilst programming elisp, and there is a (long) place name in Wales with four consecutive 'l's. But really? :-) > FWIW: Several people have expressed this idea, with which I agree. > C-u should do nothing by itself (and that includes not exiting > Isearch, of course). C-u is bound to a command, namely `universal-argument', and we do our users a disservice if we try to pretend otherwise. > Its only effect should be to provide a prefix argument to the next > command, to extend its behavior. No. When in isearch, it first exits isearch and then generates the prefix argument (4). It exits isearch like (almost) any other non-character keysequence does. What is now going down is that C-u will _sometimes_ exit isearch, sometimes not. This is going to leave a squidgy uncomfortable feeling in the stomach of anybody who thinks about it, yet hasn't explicitly enabled this behaviour. isearch-allow-scroll isn't enabled by default, so why should isearch-enable-prefix, which is almost (but not quite) as radical a departure from classical Emacs, be? The anomaly we're stumbling over here is the (almost?) unique status of isearch as a modal (in the vi sense) behaviour in Emacs. > I hope it helps. > -- > Dani Moncayo -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).