From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Luc Teirlinck Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: customize-apropos Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2005 22:18:34 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <200512150418.jBF4IYM26925@raven.dms.auburn.edu> References: <200512122356.jBCNuaQ07998@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <200512140114.jBE1EjD17297@raven.dms.auburn.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1134620485 13682 80.91.229.2 (15 Dec 2005 04:21:25 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 04:21:25 +0000 (UTC) Cc: drew.adams@oracle.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Dec 15 05:21:23 2005 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Emkbd-000621-19 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 15 Dec 2005 05:20:37 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EmkcF-0000i4-Lk for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 14 Dec 2005 23:21:15 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Emkc5-0000hx-EU for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 14 Dec 2005 23:21:05 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1Emkc4-0000hj-EI for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 14 Dec 2005 23:21:05 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Emkc4-0000he-A4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 14 Dec 2005 23:21:04 -0500 Original-Received: from [131.204.53.104] (helo=manatee.dms.auburn.edu) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1EmkeE-0002Uf-Ep; Wed, 14 Dec 2005 23:23:18 -0500 Original-Received: from raven.dms.auburn.edu (raven.dms.auburn.edu [131.204.53.29]) by manatee.dms.auburn.edu (8.13.3+Sun/8.13.3) with ESMTP id jBF4KC5f013520; Wed, 14 Dec 2005 22:20:12 -0600 (CST) Original-Received: (from teirllm@localhost) by raven.dms.auburn.edu (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.11.7) id jBF4IYM26925; Wed, 14 Dec 2005 22:18:34 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.dms.auburn.edu: teirllm set sender to teirllm@dms.auburn.edu using -f Original-To: rms@gnu.org In-reply-to: (rms@gnu.org) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.1 (manatee.dms.auburn.edu [131.204.53.104]); Wed, 14 Dec 2005 22:20:12 -0600 (CST) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:47770 Archived-At: Richard Stallman wrote: NO CUSTOMIZATION DATA; set this only if you know what you are doing. is better, because it avoids an overly broad interpretation of the warning. There is no harm in using the customization buffer in any way except to set the variable. Not quite. Saving and especially various forms of resetting give more problems that the (actually relatively problem free) setting for the current session. What else is there? I now believe that a better string would be: NO CUSTOMIZATION DATA; not intended to be customized. I believe that this best summarizes the two involved problems. Setting, saving and resetting _to current_ work perfectly. The two only problems are: Firstly, there are some problems with the other reset operations, because of a lack of customization data. The first part of the message points that out. Secondly, by using defvar instead of defcustom, a programmer indicates his belief that setting this variable through Custom is not advisable, either because he considers the variable to be internal (no * in docstring) or because he believes that setting the default value (as opposed to buffer local values) makes no sense (* in docstring, no defcustom). The second part of my new proposed message points that out to the user. I do not believe that there are any other problems. (But these two, especially the second, are bad enough.) Sincerely, Luc.