From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Luc Teirlinck Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: More bugs in Custom themes Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 20:04:53 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <200507010104.j6114rD07388@raven.dms.auburn.edu> References: <200506300152.j5U1qBo01566@raven.dms.auburn.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1120181234 25716 80.91.229.2 (1 Jul 2005 01:27:14 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2005 01:27:14 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jul 01 03:27:08 2005 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DoAJA-0000pP-4u for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 01 Jul 2005 03:27:08 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DoARW-0002KG-9K for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 21:35:46 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1DoARD-0002Hv-Nc for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 21:35:27 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1DoAN9-0001C2-GA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 21:31:17 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DoAMz-000119-MT for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 21:31:08 -0400 Original-Received: from [131.204.53.104] (helo=manatee.dms.auburn.edu) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1DoA4Y-0004op-H1; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 21:12:02 -0400 Original-Received: from raven.dms.auburn.edu (raven.dms.auburn.edu [131.204.53.29]) by manatee.dms.auburn.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j6116kCK001453; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 20:06:46 -0500 (CDT) Original-Received: (from teirllm@localhost) by raven.dms.auburn.edu (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.11.7) id j6114rD07388; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 20:04:53 -0500 (CDT) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.dms.auburn.edu: teirllm set sender to teirllm@dms.auburn.edu using -f Original-To: rms@gnu.org In-reply-to: (rms@gnu.org) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:39993 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:39993 First new bug. After requiring a theme and then setting and saving some option through Custom, all my customizations for all options for which the theme specified a value were deleted. Can you fix that? Second new bug: `custom-create-theme' can not handle variables with a defcustom that needs a :require and there are a lot of those. Can you fix that one? The current code appears to need a complete rewrite, not just fixing of a few bugs. This rewrite has to be done carefully, because the current attempt at implementation has been superimposed on the entire Custom code. No need. We won't make the release before fixing this up. This is an important feature. We are not going to give up on it. We're going to *fix it and make it work*, and then we will make the release. Custom themes would be a completely new complex feature, not a bug fix: Custom themes did not come remotely close to working in any prior Emacs version. I do not suggest giving up on it, but I do suggest putting it off until after the 22 release. Custom themes may be important, but I do not believe that they are important enough to put off the release of 22 from a possible 2005 date to some very vague and very distant future. I know of various remaining problems concerning the manuals and the code. These _really_ need fixing and fixing all of them would be less difficult and less time consuming than coming up with a workable Custom themes implementation. If we fix these first, we can make a release and we may have a shot at still doing that in 2005. After that, we could concentrate on Custom themes. Correctly implementing Custom themes is complex and will be time-consuming. People have a need for multiple themes with conflicting settings, that can be individually removed, so we can not make any simplifying assumptions. The implementation, once ready, will need thorough testing (people writing and using themes). It is impossible to guarantee a time table. Sincerely, Luc.