From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Luc Teirlinck Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: `xterm-mouse-mode' has a bogus Custom group Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 20:49:55 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <200504130149.j3D1ntP19821@raven.dms.auburn.edu> References: <200504020351.j323ppS16391@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <16974.11752.332998.125628@farnswood.snap.net.nz> <200504021346.j32Dk3e19471@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <16978.12100.857894.861739@farnswood.snap.net.nz> <200504060000.j3600bm15264@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <16979.20638.871209.55398@farnswood.snap.net.nz> <200504070045.j370j0J27252@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <16981.58243.428189.615765@farnswood.snap.net.nz> <200504081605.j38G5ia15320@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <16982.64939.154130.463783@farnswood.snap.net.nz> <200504090406.j3946HQ22712@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <01c53d89$Blat.v2.4$96f0bb20@zahav.net.il> <200504101318.j3ADID528159@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <200504120212.j3C2CNc11392@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <200504130001.j3D01Cn19635@raven.d NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1113357499 4919 80.91.229.2 (13 Apr 2005 01:58:19 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 01:58:19 +0000 (UTC) Cc: eliz@gnu.org, rms@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Apr 13 03:58:16 2005 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DLX8o-0000ro-0X for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 13 Apr 2005 03:58:06 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DLWjE-0000uW-AS for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 12 Apr 2005 21:31:40 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1DLWip-0000pc-50 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 12 Apr 2005 21:31:15 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1DLWik-0000lq-P9 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 12 Apr 2005 21:31:11 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1DLWik-0000j0-0Z for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 12 Apr 2005 21:31:10 -0400 Original-Received: from [131.204.53.104] (helo=manatee.dms.auburn.edu) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1DLX2j-0006jF-Tl; Tue, 12 Apr 2005 21:51:50 -0400 Original-Received: from raven.dms.auburn.edu (raven.dms.auburn.edu [131.204.53.29]) by manatee.dms.auburn.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j3D1pW9N019004; Tue, 12 Apr 2005 20:51:32 -0500 (CDT) Original-Received: (from teirllm@localhost) by raven.dms.auburn.edu (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.11.7) id j3D1ntP19821; Tue, 12 Apr 2005 20:49:55 -0500 (CDT) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.dms.auburn.edu: teirllm set sender to teirllm@dms.auburn.edu using -f Original-To: dak@gnu.org In-reply-to: <85zmw3efnt.fsf@gnu.org> (message from David Kastrup on Wed, 13 Apr 2005 01:31:02 +0200) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:35917 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:35917 David Kastrup wrote: Tooltips are an optional help. A lot of people make do without them. XEmacs has no working tooltips even today. So this is not so very tragic. I did not complain about absence of tooltips as such. I personally disable tooltips, even under a window system. But with Xterm Mouse mode, you do not get their replacement, echo area messages either. That is the problem. And there is no mouse face. The "fireworks" are not destructive and usually deliver a text message what happened. I don't see much of a problem here. A not very experienced user has two windows, one showing Info. He clicks mouse-2 on the Info buffer mode line to make it cover the entire frame. But that is not what happens. Instead, the Info buffer widens. The poor user may not even know what narrowing is, or how Info is internally implemented. He may have no idea what happened or what to do next. We might want assign a mouse-button+modifier combination to explictly providing a tooltip in the echo area: Even with Xterm Mouse mode enabled, mouse-button+modifier combinations get handled by the terminal emulator, not by Emacs. Sincerely, Luc.