From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Luc Teirlinck Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: doc elisp intro cross reference fixes Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 16:38:29 -0600 (CST) Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Message-ID: <200311192238.hAJMcTM06424@raven.dms.auburn.edu> References: <87wua28zux.fsf@zip.com.au> <87ad6vdsxi.fsf@mail.jurta.org> <200311190418.hAJ4ITC02466@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <200311190528.hAJ5SrK02553@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <3FBBD155.2050703@yahoo.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: deer.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1069282502 16475 80.91.224.253 (19 Nov 2003 22:55:02 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 22:55:02 +0000 (UTC) Cc: ihs_4664@yahoo.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Wed Nov 19 23:54:57 2003 Return-path: Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.224.244]) by deer.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AMbDt-0003Ye-00 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2003 23:54:57 +0100 Original-Received: from monty-python.gnu.org ([199.232.76.173]) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1AMbDt-0002gz-00 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2003 23:54:57 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.24) id 1AMcAq-0005lI-UH for emacs-devel@quimby.gnus.org; Wed, 19 Nov 2003 18:55:52 -0500 Original-Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.24) id 1AMc8i-0004MV-Ml for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 19 Nov 2003 18:53:40 -0500 Original-Received: from mail by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.24) id 1AMc7n-0003Te-Vf for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 19 Nov 2003 18:53:15 -0500 Original-Received: from [131.204.53.104] (helo=manatee.dms.auburn.edu) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.24) id 1AMc1A-00006b-6h for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 19 Nov 2003 18:45:52 -0500 Original-Received: from raven.dms.auburn.edu (raven.dms.auburn.edu [131.204.53.29]) by manatee.dms.auburn.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id hAJMiLKk029037; Wed, 19 Nov 2003 16:44:21 -0600 (CST) Original-Received: (from teirllm@localhost) by raven.dms.auburn.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id hAJMcTM06424; Wed, 19 Nov 2003 16:38:29 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.dms.auburn.edu: teirllm set sender to teirllm@dms.auburn.edu using -f Original-To: monnier@IRO.UMontreal.CA In-reply-to: (message from Stefan Monnier on 19 Nov 2003 16:15:55 -0500) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2 Precedence: list List-Id: Emacs development discussions. List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:17932 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:17932 Stefan Monnier wrote: > And I don't understand what startup vs. session time has to do with it: > it only has to do with whether set-variable can be used interactively. That was the distinction proposed by Luc. I did not "propose" anything. I quoted current standards from the Elisp manual. There are (combining both quotes) at least three reasons not to use `*' in a defcustom (but they combine to one more general reason): 1. Setting the variable with set-variable would not have any effect other than maybe to confuse Emacs internals or the user. This is probably the main reason. 2. The value is long and/or complex and specifying or editing it in the minibuffer is going to be awkward. 3. It would be set only in init files. This is one that is apparently not followed consistently at all. `inhibit-startup-message' has a `*' in its documentation string. I doubt that setting it interactively with set-variable is going to have a lot of effect. Anybody trying to do so is probably mistakenly believing that it is going to affect future sessions. Basically, everything can be summarized with: "use `*' if and only if setting the variable with `set-variable' makes sense". I should say that the fact set-variable itself will indeed not distinguish (not even for completion) between `*' or no `*' is not very consistent with this. Sincerely, Luc.