From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Luc Teirlinck Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Changing the no-toolkit scrollbar thumb color. (minor issue) Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2003 11:42:59 -0500 (CDT) Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Message-ID: <200309281642.h8SGgxc11119@raven.dms.auburn.edu> References: <87fzijz4th.fsf@raven.i.defaultvalue.org> <200309262123.h8QLNNi07638@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <200309272155.h8RLttv09524@raven.dms.auburn.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: deer.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1064767751 3994 80.91.224.253 (28 Sep 2003 16:49:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2003 16:49:11 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Sun Sep 28 18:49:09 2003 Return-path: Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.224.244]) by deer.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1A3ejN-0006sZ-00 for ; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 18:49:09 +0200 Original-Received: from monty-python.gnu.org ([199.232.76.173]) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1A3ejM-0007Ku-00 for ; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 18:49:09 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1A3eiA-00030a-84 for emacs-devel@quimby.gnus.org; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 12:47:54 -0400 Original-Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.22) id 1A3ehU-0002n4-Tu for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 12:47:12 -0400 Original-Received: from mail by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.22) id 1A3ehQ-0002jK-Ox for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 12:47:11 -0400 Original-Received: from [131.204.53.104] (helo=manatee.dms.auburn.edu) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1A3eh2-0002Y3-Hr for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 12:46:45 -0400 Original-Received: from raven.dms.auburn.edu (raven.dms.auburn.edu [131.204.53.29]) by manatee.dms.auburn.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id h8SGkfAJ005219; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 11:46:41 -0500 (CDT) Original-Received: (from teirllm@localhost) by raven.dms.auburn.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id h8SGgxc11119; Sun, 28 Sep 2003 11:42:59 -0500 (CDT) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.dms.auburn.edu: teirllm set sender to teirllm@dms.auburn.edu using -f Original-To: bob@rattlesnake.com In-reply-to: (bob@rattlesnake.com) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2 Precedence: list List-Id: Emacs development discussions. List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:16726 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:16726 Robert Chassell wrote: But the problem is worse than inadaquate documentation. The current message from `customize-face' is *false*. The `customize-face' method tells you that it has changed the foreground and background faces of the scroll bars when it has not. I do not know exactly what you are referring to. Is it the "State" message, like: State: you have set this face, but not saved it for future sessions. Strictly speaking this is accurate and relevant even if it has no effect on the scroll bar. It does not say that you have successfully changed the colors of the scroll bar, it says that you have set the face. You can use any face for any purpose whatsoever. When Emacs functions prompt for a face, I often use faces that are normally used for something completely different, as long as I know that there will be no conflict between the two uses. Maybe the documentation string could be improved. The `customize-face RET scroll-bar' feature needs to * check for the tool kit in use and if it is `GTK+' {i.e, if (featurep 'gtk) returns t}, - either have `customize-face' do the right thing, whatever that be, or - tell the user that `customize-face' fails with GTK and that the user must modify his or her ~/.emacs.d/gtkrc file. The work to be done to the ~/.emacs.d/gtkrc file needs to be described in a manner that a novice can understand. I do not know a lot about GTK. Somebody who does (Jan?) could tell you whether your first suggestion is possible at all, as well as answer your other GTK related questions. In as far as the second suggestion is concerned, I believe that this information should be conveyed in the documentation string, not through an error message. Somebody may have several builds of Emacs and want to use the same .emacs for all of them or may want to use the face for his own purposes. The information actually is conveyed in the documentation string, though maybe not clearly enough: Basic face for the scroll bar colors under X. ^^^^^^^^ There are some other problems. I will follow up on them. Sincerely, Luc.