From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Stefan Monnier" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Will default key bindings spell the death of Emacs? Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 20:10:44 -0400 Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Message-ID: <200305300010.h4U0AiNY018227@rum.cs.yale.edu> References: <3ED67422.7060305@math.ku.dk> <20030529214728.GA24984@gnu.org> <3ED68408.4080700@math.ku.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1054253765 8520 80.91.224.249 (30 May 2003 00:16:05 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 00:16:05 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Fri May 30 02:16:02 2003 Return-path: Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.224.244]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19LXYv-0002Cr-00 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 02:16:01 +0200 Original-Received: from monty-python.gnu.org ([199.232.76.173]) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 19LXnp-0004Q4-00 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 02:31:25 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 19LXVp-00052b-Ah for emacs-devel@quimby.gnus.org; Thu, 29 May 2003 20:12:49 -0400 Original-Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.20) id 19LXUc-0004dG-9H for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 29 May 2003 20:11:34 -0400 Original-Received: from mail by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.20) id 19LXU4-0003xZ-LT for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 29 May 2003 20:11:01 -0400 Original-Received: from rum.cs.yale.edu ([128.36.229.169]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 19LXTo-0003iG-T7 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 29 May 2003 20:10:44 -0400 Original-Received: from rum.cs.yale.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rum.cs.yale.edu (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4U0Ai0i018229; Thu, 29 May 2003 20:10:44 -0400 Original-Received: (from monnier@localhost) by rum.cs.yale.edu (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4U0AiNY018227; Thu, 29 May 2003 20:10:44 -0400 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.4 06/23/2000 with nmh-1.0.4 Original-To: Lars Hansen X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b5 Precedence: list List-Id: Emacs development discussions. List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: List-Unsubscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:14445 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:14445 > I do not argue that we should implement MS Windows-like keybindings. I just > argue that it should be easyer to change key bindings. What exactly are you suggesting to make it easier ? You'll get better feedback if you show us actual concrete problems rather than philosophical arguments about how things should be easier. I'm not sure what you mean by keybindings being hard to change, but let's suppose it's because C-c, C-x and ESC are so pervasive that you can't really move them. I think you can solve this using mappings such as: (define-key key-translation-map [?\C-c] [control-c]) so that hitting C-c will now lookup bindings on the `control-c' key which is completely free for you to use. Or you can swap to keys: (define-key key-translation-map [?\C-x] [?\A-x]) (define-key key-translation-map [?\A-x] [?\C-x]) so that all the C-x bindings are now actually on your Alt-x key (assuming you have both Alt and Meta keys) and vice versa. Very few applications are as flexible when it comes to configuring key bindings. If you don't like long-key-combos and prefer having different modes, you can try M-x viper RET which offers a completely different set of bindings which many people like. Stefan