From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Jody Goldberg Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Gtk scrollbar: thumb too short Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 17:46:46 -0500 Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Message-ID: <20030327224646.GB30259@athlon.thegoldbergs.ca> References: <20030325193739.ZGIN3924.fep01-svc.swip.net@gaffa.gaia.swipnet.se> <1048780121.14517.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> <200303271630.h2RGU1bT028651@rum.cs.yale.edu> <1048799271.15136.69.camel@localhost.localdomain> <200303272142.PAA27945@eel.dms.auburn.edu> <1048801290.15149.88.camel@localhost.localdomain> <200303272218.QAA27988@eel.dms.auburn.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1048805297 7225 80.91.224.249 (27 Mar 2003 22:48:17 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 22:48:17 +0000 (UTC) Cc: monnier+gnu/emacs@rum.cs.yale.edu Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Thu Mar 27 23:48:14 2003 Return-path: Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.224.244]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18ygAQ-0001sN-00 for ; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 23:48:14 +0100 Original-Received: from monty-python.gnu.org ([199.232.76.173]) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 18ygCV-0004IU-00 for ; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 23:50:23 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.10.13) id 18ygA9-0003Js-05 for emacs-devel@quimby.gnus.org; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 17:47:57 -0500 Original-Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.10.13) id 18yg9j-0002kc-00 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 17:47:31 -0500 Original-Received: from mail by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.10.13) id 18yg9g-0002cw-00 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 17:47:29 -0500 Original-Received: from cpe0000e8e169cd-cm400049342024.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com ([24.101.66.211] helo=parallel.thegoldbergs.ca) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.10.13) id 18yg9G-00028n-00; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 17:47:02 -0500 Original-Received: from athlon ([146.92.33.4] helo=athlon.thegoldbergs.ca ident=mail) by parallel.thegoldbergs.ca with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 18yg92-0007dp-00; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 17:46:48 -0500 Original-Received: from jody by athlon.thegoldbergs.ca with local (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 18yg90-0001an-00; Thu, 27 Mar 2003 17:46:46 -0500 Original-To: Luc Teirlinck Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200303272218.QAA27988@eel.dms.auburn.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i Original-cc: jan.h.d@swipnet.se Original-cc: rms@gnu.org Original-cc: kai.grossjohann@uni-duisburg.de Original-cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-cc: otaylor@redhat.com X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b5 Precedence: list List-Id: Emacs development discussions. List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: List-Unsubscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:12681 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:12681 On Thu, Mar 27, 2003 at 04:18:22PM -0600, Luc Teirlinck wrote: > > In the presence of tons of invisible text, the native scrollbar > seems to behave like I would expect it to behave. That may only be > because I have strange expectations, but anyway. Gnumeric has received alot of bug reports on this score. Some people like the thumb to indicate the visible rows, others want it to display the visible region. We have received complaints both ways. My preference is for the visible region to provide some feedback that there is hidden content. Other areas of contention in Gnumeric's scroll handling are 1) pixel vs row based. I tend to prefer the latter, but we have received complaints that things behave strangely in the presence of wide/tall cols/rows. So there is no consensus. 2) How to indicate current maxima while still permitting a scroll 'past the end'. We've chosen to allow dragging only within the current region, but permitting the the arrows to scroll further and extending the region. In this case the choice was a simple, MS Excel did it this way, and lots of fingers were used to it. I doubt this behavior scales to other application domains. A quick test indicates that neither MS Word nor oowriter have that sort of behavior. They both appear bottom out at the actual end of the document. 3) Updating thumb size while dragging That just seems irritating. If a user selcts the bottom of a large thumb at the start of the drag then the thumb shrinks they end up in an odd position.