From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Juanma Barranquero Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [CVS] f7, f8 bound.. Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 12:21:17 +0200 Sender: emacs-devel-admin@gnu.org Message-ID: <20020828120614.A710.LEKTU@terra.es> References: <20020828110346.9D11.LEKTU@terra.es> <5xznv7ckrn.fsf@kfs2.cua.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: localhost.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1030530146 3061 127.0.0.1 (28 Aug 2002 10:22:26 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 10:22:26 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Return-path: Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.224.244]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 17jzxw-0000nC-00 for ; Wed, 28 Aug 2002 12:22:24 +0200 Original-Received: from monty-python.gnu.org ([199.232.76.173]) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17k0Tg-0008TY-00 for ; Wed, 28 Aug 2002 12:55:12 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 17jzzH-0005Vi-00; Wed, 28 Aug 2002 06:23:47 -0400 Original-Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.10) id 17jzx7-0005PE-00 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 28 Aug 2002 06:21:33 -0400 Original-Received: from mail by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.10) id 17jzx4-0005Op-00 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 28 Aug 2002 06:21:32 -0400 Original-Received: from [62.22.27.141] (helo=mail.peoplecall.com) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 17jzx3-0005O4-00 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 28 Aug 2002 06:21:30 -0400 Original-Received: from [62.22.27.143] (jbarranquero.ofi.peoplecall.com [62.22.27.143]) by mail.peoplecall.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7SALHB29916; Wed, 28 Aug 2002 12:21:17 +0200 Original-To: storm@cua.dk (Kim F. Storm) In-Reply-To: <5xznv7ckrn.fsf@kfs2.cua.dk> X-Mailer: Becky! ver. 2.05.04 Errors-To: emacs-devel-admin@gnu.org X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Emacs development discussions. List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:7038 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:7038 On 28 Aug 2002 12:58:36 +0200, storm@cua.dk (Kim F. Storm) wrote: > I don't understand... you like the binding to function keys, but you > don't like that to be easily accessible to new users. Why not? Because I'm not convinced they need that access more than they do to bs-cycle-next and bs-cycle-previous, for example. And the F-keys are mostly a user convenience, to be used as he sees fit. In my experience, most new Emacs users (of the kind that barely read the tutorial, if anything) have trouble knowing how to switch buffers, and having a way to rotate between them in an easy, just-one-keystroke-away key, is good for them. They don't use many buffers anyway. But still bs.el doesn't bind F-keys by default, it just suggests doing so to F9/F10. Why? Because the binding is a matter of taste, and because a user is not going to know how to use bs anyway without reading at least a bit of documentation (and then they can copy the suggested bindings and put F5/F6 or whatever instead of F9/F10 without problem). Using macros seems natural to you and me, but users who don't know how to bind a command to a key are not going to use macros either. If they take the pain to read about them, they'll find the bit of documentation that says how to bind them to whatever they want. Who knows, perhaps they'll agree with you in that having kmacro in F-keys is good, but they strongly and religiously believe the right F-keys for macros are F11/F12! :) > To me, the function key binding issue seems more religious than practical. As most keybinding issues are. > Really ? > > Hm, yes. The documentation for C-h k f3 should be improved to briefly > explain what keyboard macros are all about. And perhaps refer them to the relevant Info node... :) /L/e/k/t/u