From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Glenn Morris Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: with-output-to-temp-buffer and help-mode Date: Fri, 25 Jul 2014 04:15:16 -0400 Message-ID: <1yppgtua5n.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1406276128 21153 80.91.229.3 (25 Jul 2014 08:15:28 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 25 Jul 2014 08:15:28 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jul 25 10:15:23 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1XAaew-0001oK-7G for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 25 Jul 2014 10:15:22 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:53557 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XAaev-0002Vw-PL for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 25 Jul 2014 04:15:21 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:56811) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XAaes-0002Vr-Tp for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Jul 2014 04:15:20 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XAaer-0007YU-TT for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Jul 2014 04:15:18 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:56512) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XAaer-0007YQ-Ph for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Jul 2014 04:15:17 -0400 Original-Received: from rgm by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XAaeq-0003WG-9U; Fri, 25 Jul 2014 04:15:16 -0400 X-Spook: Qaddafi 22nd SAS covert video anthrax illuminati Etacs X-Ran: ?mXOvb~5p.~*zU![r&3'-#nN+g(\Q43,'^;<74f X-Hue: cyan X-Attribution: GM User-Agent: Gnus (www.gnus.org), GNU Emacs (www.gnu.org/software/emacs/) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:173130 Archived-At: with-output-to-temp-buffer was changed to no longer put the buffer in help-mode. This change makes no sense to me - can someone explain the logic? Otherwise I'm thinking the change should just be reverted. I did ask in http://debbugs.gnu.org/16038#104, but I haven't seen a proper explanation. The elisp manual documents the use of help-mode (since at least 1999): This function executes the forms in BODY while arranging to insert any output they print into the buffer named BUFFER-NAME, which is first created if necessary, and put into Help mode. [...] If the forms in BODY do not change the major mode in the output buffer, so that it is still Help mode at the end of their execution, then `with-output-to-temp-buffer' makes this buffer read-only at the end, and also scans it for function and variable names to make them into clickable cross-references. I agree that: 1) the fact there is no "help" in the name is unfortunate. 2) the fact that help-mode is not mentioned in the doc-string is unfortunate. 3) the way this was implemented (via hooks) was unfortunate. However: Many (most?) uses of the thing rely on the output being in help mode. See eg http://debbugs.gnu.org/17966 . There are ~ 223 uses of with-output-to-temp-buffer in lisp/. As a first simple test, the string "help" appears on the same line as 76 of them. Nobody shows any signs of fixing all those uses, or even documenting this (incompatible) change in NEWS. So I think this should just be reverted.