From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Nick Roberts Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Post-22.1 development? Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2007 09:18:36 +1200 Message-ID: <18024.30252.846428.246125@kahikatea.snap.net.nz> References: <878xb05ras.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <864plnorgn.fsf@lola.quinscape.zz> <85ps4ap0kh.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1181251160 13956 80.91.229.12 (7 Jun 2007 21:19:20 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2007 21:19:20 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: "Sean O'Rourke" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Jun 07 23:19:18 2007 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1HwPNv-0007Ih-OC for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 07 Jun 2007 23:19:12 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HwPNu-0007pY-Up for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 07 Jun 2007 17:19:10 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1HwPNr-0007pJ-81 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jun 2007 17:19:07 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1HwPNo-0007p6-SB for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jun 2007 17:19:05 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HwPNo-0007p3-MS for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jun 2007 17:19:04 -0400 Original-Received: from viper.snap.net.nz ([202.37.101.8]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1HwPNn-0000vq-MK for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jun 2007 17:19:04 -0400 Original-Received: from kahikatea.snap.net.nz (71.62.255.123.dynamic.snap.net.nz [123.255.62.71]) by viper.snap.net.nz (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44D4D3D945E; Fri, 8 Jun 2007 09:18:56 +1200 (NZST) Original-Received: by kahikatea.snap.net.nz (Postfix, from userid 1000) id AC2578F9CE; Fri, 8 Jun 2007 09:18:37 +1200 (NZST) In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: VM 7.19 under Emacs 22.1.50.12 X-detected-kernel: Linux 2.4-2.6 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:72439 Archived-At: > I have recently experienced similar "integration with a modern > desktop environment" on Mac OS X, where we have the choice > between standard Carbon Emacs and Aquamacs, which tries to behave > more like other Mac applications. As a longtime Emacs user on > many platforms, I find Aquamacs highly unpleasant. Many of its > "enhancements," like widespread use of variable-width fonts, > color themes, and pop-up frames, are counterproductive. When there is choice I don't see how they can be counterproductive; presumably you can just use Carbon Emacs. > I already have a number of lines in my .emacs disabling various > bits of modernization (e.g. tooltip-mode, tool-bar-mode, > blink-cursor-mode, enormous fringes on both sides), Enormous is an exaggeration - they're one character wide - and since you _can_ disable them I see no problem. I don't see these features simply as modernisation. I find the toolbar useful for debugging and the fringe displays breakpoint icons. I imagine other people have other uses for them. > and expect > that acceding to Gnome's wishes would just add to this list. > Emacs has its own ways of doing things, and some of us prefer > them, and believe they are better than more "modern" > alternatives. There are many clear improvements available in > modern environments, such as the option of having anti-aliased > fonts. But I urge the Emacs developers to be wary of making > changes simply because they make Emacs more "modern," and to > continue to make it possible to disable such changes. I think a bit of flexibility is needed on both sides. This could get blown up out of proportion, but I think it should really be a small issue. -- Nick http://www.inet.net.nz/~nickrob