Re: Documenting FSF copyright assignment process

[Konstantin Kharlamov <hi-angel@yandex.ru>]

On Пт, Apr 12, 2019 at 10:00, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
>>  Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2019 02:49:09 +0300
>>  From: Konstantin Kharlamov <hi-angel@yandex.ru>
>>  Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org, rms@gnu.org
>> 
>>  > The only way I can understand this particular aspect of the issue 
>> is
>>  > by assuming that people don't read the section in the Emacs manual
>>  > where this is described, the one you quoted in your email, because
>>  > that section explicitly tells to ask on emacs-devel.
>> 
>>  Not really. The section I quoted tells to ask any questions on
>>  emacs-devel, but not to ask for the form/instructions in there.
> 
> I admit I don't understand this logic.  You are told to ask _anything_
> about the assignment process on this list, including for how to start
> the process:
> 
>      Copyright assignment is a simple process.  Residents of some
>   countries can do it entirely electronically.  We can help you get
>   started, and answer any questions you may have (or point you to the
>   people with the answers), at the <emacs-devel@gnu.org> mailing list.
> 
> So why would someone think that asking about the form is
> inappropriate?

The logic is: this whole page is a documentation about the assignment, 
it's even titled accordingly. So somewhere it should have all the gory 
details. But there's none.

And then there's a suggestion to ask any question on emacs-devel. Sure, 
absence of steps for getting assignment implies you have one; but at 
the same time the fact that you're reading the Emacs documentation on 
getting assignment implies that you shouldn't have *this specific* 
question, because sure it's documented here. So you reading it over and 
over, you look at other places, you query the internet… This makes 
one feel silly, and asking on emacs-devel becomes sort of last resort.

>>  Although GNU Emacs indeed are not the source for form, however it is
>>  Emacs that has the mandatory requirement for the assignment.
> 
> No, every GNU project has this requirement, not just Emacs.  GCC, GDB,
> Binutils, Coreutils, Bash, Diffutils, Grep, Texinfo, Gnulib, Guile,
> Wget -- you name it.  They all require an assignment.  Even submitting
> translations for messages of some program requires an assignment.
> 
>>  Okay, maybe it's not an issue for you, because you're used to the
>>  mailing list, as well as to replies to assignment form inqueries.
>> 
>>  But it is an issue for an arbitrary user who wants the form.
>> 
>>  First of: there's no requirement for a contributor to be subscribed
>>  here, since patches go to debbugs site anyway. And a user may not 
>> know
>>  how to use a mailing list: does one have to subscribe? How to
>>  subscribe? What to do with dozens of mails from the list every day?
>>  Nowadays you can't reasonably expect arbitrary peoples to know how 
>> MLs
>>  work.
>> 
>>  Second: a user may not be a native speaker, so composing a mail may
>>  take time for that alone reason. You can't expect a contributor to 
>> be a
>>  good speaker either, because they could be e.g. just a student who
>>  wants to improve the app they're using as part of their paper.
>> 
>>  Third: sending to a -devel ML means asking real developers. This 
>> may be
>>  an overwhelming thought, making one to try to avoid that as much as
>>  possible. I'm telling that from my own past experience: though right
>>  now I'm comfortable (I work as a developer, I contributed to many
>>  projects, I just got used to being around developers), but it wasn't
>>  always true. Just 3-4 years ago I'd be really afraid, thinking "But
>>  assignment form doesn't sound like a development question, am I sure
>>  this is correct? Won't they make laugh of me?".
>> 
>>  Fourth: sending to an ML means there's a bunch of people, and 
>> everyone
>>  gonna see your mail. If you have social communication problems, for
>>  example sociophobia, this is a demotivational factor.
>> 
>>  Fifth: asking specifically for copyright assignment on ML feels like
>>  yelling "look everyone, I'm gonna contribute to Emacs!", whereas one
>>  may not even be sure about usefulness of planned contributions. One 
>> may
>>  just have some thoughts for improvements, but they may not pan out 
>> for
>>  one reason or another. I think this may demotivate anyone, doubly 
>> so if
>>  one has social communication problems.
>> 
>>  And don't forget that the factors can be combined! Whereas the fix 
>> is
>>  dead easy: just make it clear how to get the form and instructions
>>  without any interaction.
> 
> With the relevant information now explicitly spelled in CONTRIBUTE, I
> think these issues are more-or-less solved now.

Thank you! Btw, I just looked at log for CONTRIBUTE 
http://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs.git/log/CONTRIBUTE I don't seem 
to see anything new. Are they perhaps on review?