From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Chad Brown Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: improving network utility calls in lisp/net/net-utils.el Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 17:42:21 -0700 Message-ID: <0766365C-9A72-4AD7-B808-B8DF141F105D@mit.edu> References: <87ljq8lk9u.fsf@rabkins.net> <87y6u8k3bo.fsf@rabkins.net> <49DF7679.20700@harpegolden.net> <87eiw0v1eq.fsf@rabkins.net> <49DFA7A5.4090606@harpegolden.net> <873acgqkk9.fsf@rabkins.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v930.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1239422610 29723 80.91.229.12 (11 Apr 2009 04:03:30 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 11 Apr 2009 04:03:30 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Yoni Rabkin Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Apr 11 06:04:49 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1LsUSV-00068W-Tm for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 11 Apr 2009 06:04:48 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54220 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LsUR7-0004UI-Lw for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 11 Apr 2009 00:03:21 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LsRIj-00040c-Ea for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 10 Apr 2009 20:42:29 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=53709 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LsRIi-0003yX-IF for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 10 Apr 2009 20:42:28 -0400 Original-Received: from biscayne-one-station.mit.edu ([18.7.7.80]:62885) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1LsRIi-0006wq-A2 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 10 Apr 2009 20:42:28 -0400 Original-Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (OUTGOING-AUTH.MIT.EDU [18.7.22.103]) by biscayne-one-station.mit.edu (8.13.6/8.9.2) with ESMTP id n3B0gPYt027969; Fri, 10 Apr 2009 20:42:26 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from [10.0.1.3] (c-98-247-149-76.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [98.247.149.76]) (authenticated bits=0) (User authenticated as yandros@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.13.6/8.12.4) with ESMTP id n3B0gM8t004343 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Fri, 10 Apr 2009 20:42:24 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: <873acgqkk9.fsf@rabkins.net> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.930.3) X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.42 X-Spam-Score: 0.00 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: Solaris 9 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 11 Apr 2009 00:03:16 -0400 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:110202 Archived-At: I suspect it comes down to usage patterns, but if something is wrong (network-wise), then the following two things happen: a) people are more likely to want to use the commands b) the commands are more likely to hang, be slow, etc. In particular, it's really not hard to get into a situation where dns name resolution will fail, but won't give up for a couple minutes. Nobody wants emacs to hang for two minutes to tell them that something's broken, especially when they were originally asking because something looked to be broken. Back when I had to care about such things professionally, I took to using a program called mtr to check on such situations. I would have preferred to use something built into emacs, until the first time it made emacs hang. Put another way, my former self would have been quite happy to see your proposal as long as it didn't require synchronized processes. I imagine that there are still quite a few people in my former boat, so don't get discouraged. It shouldn't be hard to made it work with an async process, and afterward you will have learned (assuming you don't already know) something cool about emacs. Regardless, thanks for your efforts to improve emacs. *chad