From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: v for view-mode Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 15:20:27 -0800 Message-ID: <007a01c86d04$b0555be0$9eb22382@us.oracle.com> References: <87lk5rbket.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <86d4r3ut6f.fsf@timbral.net> <871w7jaykg.fsf@catnip.gol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1202772108 19954 80.91.229.12 (11 Feb 2008 23:21:48 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 23:21:48 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: "'Miles Bader'" , "'Evans Winner'" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Feb 12 00:22:10 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1JOhyG-0001h2-D3 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 12 Feb 2008 00:21:56 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JOhxm-0002wW-Rq for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 18:21:26 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JOhxi-0002wP-UA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 18:21:22 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JOhxg-0002wD-Fv for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 18:21:21 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JOhxg-0002wA-Am for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 18:21:20 -0500 Original-Received: from rgminet01.oracle.com ([148.87.113.118]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1JOhxc-0006Po-Lr; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 18:21:16 -0500 Original-Received: from agmgw1.us.oracle.com (agmgw1.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.212]) by rgminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.6) with ESMTP id m1BNLDOm008327; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 16:21:13 -0700 Original-Received: from acsmt350.oracle.com (acsmt350.oracle.com [141.146.40.150]) by agmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m1BAJgb9002571; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 16:21:13 -0700 Original-Received: from inet-141-146-46-1.oracle.com by acsmt351.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3567122541202772025; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 15:20:25 -0800 Original-Received: from dradamslap1 (/130.35.178.158) by bhmail.oracle.com (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Mon, 11 Feb 2008 15:20:25 -0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: <871w7jaykg.fsf@catnip.gol.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Thread-Index: AchtAiUbiVvsVc86SwKak9sYCf8sMgAAk56Q X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.4-2.6 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:88801 Archived-At: > > Since "view-mode" sucks in just about every conceivable > > way, and is AFAICT, un-salvageable, here's a more > > minimalist (but less sucky) replacement you might enjoy: > > > > As someone who uses view-mode every day and finds it pretty > > satisfactory (and your replacement would not, in itself be > > so, for my purposes) I am interested to know exactly what it > > is that you think sucks about view-mode. > > It's a huge mess of needlessly complicated (and often downright wrong, > e.g., all the bizarre code that does size calculation, which has no > obvious purpose, and yet screws up common usage scenarios) code. > It gets even the most basic functionality wrong; e..g, the reason I > whipped up more-mode is that hitting SPC in view-mode seemed to scroll > by _more_ than one page in a particular buffer! Why? Who knows, I > don't care, but even a simple C-v does the right thing. > > Because view-mode such a huge mess, it's hard to fix (technically). > Moreover, for better or for worse, people on emacs-devel are very > conservative about changing it, so even the smallest change requires a > vast amount of time arguing on this list. > > Since I just want a simple pager that actually works correctly in the > most common case, it's far, far, easier to just write one > than expend a lot of effort on a turd like view-mode. Agreed wrt view-mode's complexity. And don't forget the hyperbolic (or is it metabolic?) view-mode quitting code. Bind-moggling.