From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Christopher Dimech Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#58459: Getting a fresh emacs session with no customisation Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2022 20:35:14 +0200 Message-ID: References: <3gN0Jqr94UeUj3xJtDV3zGvZVbUyjtQFAloYxrdvwN_ZHa3tEUYyFv8h3VcYYSk_gxgMaaBW94kAkaAUCgbd9QKZMkkYJBty-7XOadbzHHQ=@proton.me> <87fsfsc9af.fsf@yahoo.com> <83o7ufafow.fsf@gnu.org> <83edvbae5a.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="23997"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: luangruo@yahoo.com, psainty@orcon.net.nz, Eli Zaretskii , 58459@debbugs.gnu.org, stefankangas@gmail.com To: uzibalqa@proton.me Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Oct 13 20:36:26 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oj34D-00064B-KF for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; 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Thu, 13 Oct 2022 20:35:14 +0200 Importance: normal Sensitivity: Normal In-Reply-To: X-UI-Message-Type: mail X-Priority: 3 X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:n9Z/+p4gLDQ2OICN1r0rqoRDd7JtNd1sjSjy+m4Ck+UouHZJugYm/lqPtb8ybH+lHm9Mr LmFnNk+atk34QZRV+2pCyD4G2OLy04vmbMRLTQg9pF9xedq+3tPSPUrf96NV/9/+9D8uLacSwMDg lskRnj2sCZJXzjY3I/NocXByOnwI1Vmocs/ZWUexydZiQNOnfPM6ltLobuBMQek8/coHXqMX7Y5U uY4oM1q0Mi4yP5DaetT7jM11WYKPPl58QJSp1FIY0hN2eUp9vZ/Xyjzx6owBo/V0GSg3AwxX0fz+ xE= X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:sYZkwIo0r+s=:XL5vdST7s38uRml1cD/Nvw BMCPZBlkS4UvNLG156rVUkkYay1/ni9gYiJpk7M0gf91xXqL6ozW/WV1+nNM9dFCJP/uwxqcj HcZb5fzlUEbCsoa4qWodyrMgLCijjJeNmcjEm6vNCdrpkVl6zJht4ppwd4RJ+0/7bW2tCN3FE U5Uso9up+Rup8UZjN/FB+PoPonfRYvoUqVBptcBzUbd+Xu8v0Ok91CXYstL63VYdZIZuR9/dl 5Nb+aoFGW73pdCIYZqkb9QPf7xTY4bfrK4MtF5H0ZLtcqIUYC05XWrvmypg8LpOOUO//kML1+ f4Irawj085Ew7NFoQHksPMZ+qqt8LHwXSnKqG0NucV7DARdy/UbQExR0xCY7Pom9uVqYK5ooQ gZjhWfCtcdX+Kph6DiAf19hcQ4XigNGUzP6ETyHjPsDfJvDjhsc3FDXxkhjSHlBOrPRmPcBTL kSWY1mF9oS7TF8xxcsL94VEs2xVefGCuqhp2eWUTnLeYqUiMIW+zAppoQt4hOY8vIC0dXKu7K 4BpA7+PIlkNuF1RDBNXRg/haotn4JdeKRQlx6i5ELrNlwj/L+L7Hc/lIsihVerg9pj3uL21S9 aK4bJDBe1if0reF90/v9bK7SysbByv/cA/HEh01O/KmzA2Kw7PWe6+Y3eDzfArL5MDnmxuiPs n8tOvxFPingoiZ9H5kKxBfPlX5131w9MzoELlWpMvPKdV5UaLMGhpLxzoL2ZW6YHQIyUc2QOs H+SvYNq8PI6Dx32oQEMZ8u+Bd+lz2mYGj6hrk+saNlYBC9CUVHWghtjt3+qZUeWWsvWifw2C X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:245339 Archived-At: > Sent: Friday, October 14, 2022 at 5:51 AM > From: "uzibalqa via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of t= ext editors" > To: "Eli Zaretskii" > Cc: luangruo@yahoo.com, psainty@orcon.net.nz, 58459@debbugs.gnu.org, ste= fankangas@gmail.com > Subject: bug#58459: Getting a fresh emacs session with no customisation > > > ------- Original Message ------- > On Thursday, October 13th, 2022 at 4:20 PM, Eli Zaretskii = wrote: > > > > > Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2022 16:06:21 +0000 > > > From: uzibalqa uzibalqa@proton.me > > > Cc: luangruo@yahoo.com, psainty@orcon.net.nz, 58459@debbugs.gnu.org,= stefankangas@gmail.com > > > > > > > And X resources are as much user settings as what the user sets on= the > > > > init files. So Emacs cannot but obey them. It is user's > > > > responsibility to set up his/her settings according to his/her > > > > preferences. > > > > > > Untrue again. Emacs obeys them because it decided to obey them. > > > > > > No, Emacs obeys them because programs on X obey them. And because > > Emacs obeyed them since time immemoriam. > > You know they can be incorrect because any program can set them up, > rather than entirely by the user. Even when my x-resources files are > empty, emacs goes out of its ways to get them from who knows where. > "Because emacsn obeyed them since time immemoriam" has always been > the standard response, rather than employing a rational and conscious > approach. > > > Any further argument is really futile, because we will not stop > > supporting X resources. It is your responsibility as the user to set > > up the X resources on your system, or invoke Emacs in a way that > > instructs Emacs to ignore those resources. > > It is not the responsibility to set up the X resources. Most times user= s > do not configure x-resources for emacs, as has been stated. It only off= ers > limitless amount of confusion. > > Have never asked to stop supporting x-resources, but to support them dif= ferently. > > > Please, just accept our position on this, even if you disagree, > > because it will not change. > > Of course, I knew that all along. Nothing changes. Stallman has said that there are some technical barriers in finding someon= e interested in and capable of doing the work needed, but there is an overarching probl= em that needs to be addressed first: The code to interface Emacs to X-based GUIs needs r= ewriting by an expert, and has needed it for decades. Until it gets that rewrite, changes= in it are likely to break something. The appeal of an editor that can be extended using the Lisp language is so= mewhat limited. Because it means spending a bunch of time and energy to change it. Althou= gh it is true that few important changes can ever happen due to the friction with old us= ers.