bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[T.V Raman via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors]

I observed the following change in the last few days when using Emacs
from Git @HEAD:

Prior: With advice definitions in a byte compiled file,
those advices were effective even when the advice definitions
(byte-compiled file) were loaded before the adviced function itself was
defined.

After: The above appears  no longer to be true

As an example, Module emacspeak-advice.el advices vc-next-action --- and
this module (emacspeak-advice) is loaded early on during emacspeak
initialization.

When I later call vc-next-action during an emacs session and the
autoload pulls in vc.el, the advice definition loaded earlier is not
activated -- I have to explicitly reload module emacspeak-advice.


In GNU Emacs 28.0.50 (build 1, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.24.12, cairo version 1.16.0)
 of 2020-03-03 built on retriever.mtv.corp.google.com
Repository revision: b99cf94e9a117e532204f9d2652ec5282ddcacaa
Repository branch: master
Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.12004000
System Description: Debian GNU/Linux rodete

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Configured using:
 'configure --enable-silent-rules --prefix=/usr/local --with-modules
 --with-mailutils --without-compress-install'

Configured features:
XPM JPEG TIFF GIF PNG RSVG CAIRO SOUND GPM DBUS GSETTINGS GLIB NOTIFY
INOTIFY ACL LIBSELINUX GNUTLS LIBXML2 FREETYPE HARFBUZZ M17N_FLT LIBOTF
ZLIB TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS GTK3 X11 XDBE XIM MODULES THREADS LIBSYSTEMD
PDUMPER LCMS2 GMP

Important settings:
  value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8
  locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix

Major mode: Shell

Minor modes in effect:
  async-bytecomp-package-mode: t
  soundscape--auto: [t 0 0 100000 t soundscape-update nil idle 0]
  jabber-mode-line-mode: t
  global-edit-server-edit-mode: t
  google-emacs-support-show-upgrade-mode: t
  google3-build-global-integrate-build-manipulation-mode: t
  google3-build-integrate-build-manipulation-mode: t
  google-kg-mode: t
  recentf-mode: t
  auto-correct-mode: t
  company-prescient-mode: t
  prescient-persist-mode: t
  psession-mode: t
  psession-autosave-mode: t
  psession-savehist-mode: t
  jabber-activity-mode: t
  flx-ido-mode: t
  display-time-mode: t
  ido-ubiquitous-mode: t
  dynamic-completion-mode: t
  midnight-mode: t
  save-place-mode: t
  savehist-mode: t
  desktop-save-mode: t
  dirtrack-procfs-mode: t
  ido-everywhere: t
  global-voice-lock-mode: t
  voice-lock-mode: t
  cl-old-struct-compat-mode: t
  electric-indent-mode: t
  mouse-wheel-mode: t
  tab-bar-mode: t
  file-name-shadow-mode: t
  global-font-lock-mode: t
  font-lock-mode: t
  auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-encryption-mode: t
  auto-compression-mode: t
  transient-mark-mode: t

Load-path shadows:
/usr/local/google/home/raman/emacs/lisp/site-lisp/vm/lisp/tapestry hides /usr/local/google/home/raman/emacs/lisp/emacspeak/lisp/tapestry
/usr/local/google/home/raman/emacs/lisp/emacspeak/tvr/sudoku hides /usr/local/google/home/raman/emacs/lisp/emacspeak/lisp/sudoku
/usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/devtools/editors/emacs/snippets hides /usr/local/google/home/raman/emacs/lisp/site-lisp/snippets
/usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/devtools/editors/emacs/google hides /usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/google-20140416.1748/google
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/lispy-20200305.1858/elpa hides /usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/ivy-20200304.1416/elpa
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-section-20200226.1251/magit-section hides /usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-section
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/async-20200113.1745/dired-async hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/async/dired-async
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/async-20200113.1745/smtpmail-async hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/async/smtpmail-async
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/async-20200113.1745/async hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/async/async
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/async-20200113.1745/async-bytecomp hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/async/async-bytecomp
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/auto-complete-20170125.245/auto-complete hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/auto_complete/auto-complete
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/auto-complete-20170125.245/auto-complete-config hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/auto_complete/auto-complete-config
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-nxml hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-nxml
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-yasnippet hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-yasnippet
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-etags hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-etags
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-bbdb hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-bbdb
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-css hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-css
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-template hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-template
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-semantic hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-semantic
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-clang hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-clang
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-cmake hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-cmake
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-files hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-files
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-tng hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-tng
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-abbrev hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-abbrev
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-dabbrev-code hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-dabbrev-code
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-ispell hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-ispell
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-dabbrev hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-dabbrev
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-tempo hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-tempo
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-xcode hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-xcode
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-elisp hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-elisp
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-oddmuse hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-oddmuse
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-keywords hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-keywords
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-gtags hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-gtags
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-eclim hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-eclim
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/company-20200228.1919/company-capf hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/company_mode/company-capf
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/dash-20200119.2310/dash hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/dash/dash
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/dash-functional-20191109.1327/dash-functional hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/dash/dash-functional
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/deferred-20170901.1330/deferred hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/deferred/deferred
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/eglot-20200113.1722/eglot hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/eglot/eglot
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/epl-20180205.2049/epl hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/epl/epl
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/f-20191110.1357/f hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/f/f
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/flx-ido-20180117.1519/flx-ido hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/flx/flx-ido
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/flx-20191115.659/flx hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/flx/flx
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/flycheck-20200224.2057/flycheck hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/flycheck/flycheck
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/ghub-20200228.4/ghub-graphql hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/ghub/ghub-graphql
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/ghub-20200228.4/gsexp hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/ghub/gsexp
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/ghub-20200228.4/ghub hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/ghub/ghub
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/go-mode-20200112.2140/go-mode hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/go/go-mode
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/go-guru-20181012.330/go-guru hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/go/go-guru
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/ht-20200217.2331/ht hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/ht/ht
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/js2-mode-20200211.2057/js2-old-indent hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/js2_mode/js2-old-indent
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/js2-mode-20200211.2057/js2-mode hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/js2_mode/js2-mode
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/js2-mode-20200211.2057/js2-imenu-extras hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/js2_mode/js2-imenu-extras
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-mode hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-mode
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-subtree hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-subtree
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-utils hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-utils
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-pull hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-pull
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-pkg hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-pkg
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-repos hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-repos
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-diff hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-diff
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-fetch hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-fetch
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-reset hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-reset
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-autorevert hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-autorevert
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/git-rebase hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/git-rebase
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-patch hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-patch
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-section-20200226.1251/magit-section hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-section
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-git hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-git
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/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-refs hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-refs
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/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-commit hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-commit
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-imenu hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-imenu
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-margin hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-margin
/usr/local/google/home/raman/.emacs.d/elpa/magit-20200303.124/magit-log hides /usr/share/google-emacs/site-lisp/emacs-google-config/third_party/elisp/magit/lisp/magit-log
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Features:
(shadow emacsbug url-irc google-browse p4-google p4 ps-print
ps-print-loaddefs ps-def lpr ...)

Memory information:
((conses 16 4640980 2282262)
 (symbols 48 113158 282)
 (strings 32 2872553 250077)
 (string-bytes 1 114941535)
 (vectors 16 652022)
 (vector-slots 8 8750851 722998)
 (floats 8 147640 606)
 (intervals 56 55188 41050)
 (buffers 1000 259))

-- 
Id: kg:/m/0285kf1 

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[Stefan Monnier]

IIUC after recompiling everything the problem disappeared.  If you
can't reproduce it any more, than I guess we can only close this
bug.

> As an example, Module emacspeak-advice.el advices vc-next-action --- and
> this module (emacspeak-advice) is loaded early on during emacspeak
> initialization.
>
> When I later call vc-next-action during an emacs session and the
> autoload pulls in vc.el, the advice definition loaded earlier is not
> activated -- I have to explicitly reload module emacspeak-advice.

In case you can still reproduce the problem, please show us what
`C-h o vc-next-action` tells you when you think it should have the
advice applied yet its behavior doesn't seem to be affected.


        Stefan

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[T.V Raman via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors]

Assume you meant C-h f -- not C-h o ---- go ahead and close the bug, if
it repros (I hope not) I'll reopen with additional details
-- 

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[Stefan Monnier]

> Assume you meant C-h f -- not C-h o ----

Either works, but I don't use `C-h f` any more nowadays.

> go ahead and close the bug,
> if it repros (I hope not) I'll reopen with additional details

OK, thanks,


        Stefan

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[T.V Raman via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors]

Hi Stefan,

I have a conjecture as to when/how this bug bites, wanted to run the
thought by you.

So the bug bit again yesterday --- and here is how it went away:

1. Emacspeak is made up of a large number of modules  and many of the
"extension" modules that define package-specific advice load earlier
core modules.

2. I've always done a require of these dependencies and the byte-compile
is clean, ie almost 0 warnings from the emacspeak side.

3. I have a Makefile to do the build, and about a year ago (or may be
two) I  added "-j" to  one of the Makefile targets.

4. As mentioned in this bug report at the outset I started seeing
strange behavior (that also appeared non-deterministic across builds)
where it felt like some of the advice was not defined (incidentally when
the bug bit yesterday, C-h o still indicated the functions were
adviced).

So wild conjecture:  Given make -j (the Makefile does impose some
dependency order but not all)
is it possible that things go south if something that is needed during
the build of module-a.el gets byte-compiled *after* module-a.el? 
Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> writes:

> IIUC after recompiling everything the problem disappeared.  If you
> can't reproduce it any more, than I guess we can only close this
> bug.
>
>> As an example, Module emacspeak-advice.el advices vc-next-action --- and
>> this module (emacspeak-advice) is loaded early on during emacspeak
>> initialization.
>>
>> When I later call vc-next-action during an emacs session and the
>> autoload pulls in vc.el, the advice definition loaded earlier is not
>> activated -- I have to explicitly reload module emacspeak-advice.
>
> In case you can still reproduce the problem, please show us what
> `C-h o vc-next-action` tells you when you think it should have the
> advice applied yet its behavior doesn't seem to be affected.
>
>
>         Stefan
>

-- 

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[Stefan Monnier]

> 4. As mentioned in this bug report at the outset I started seeing
> strange behavior (that also appeared non-deterministic across builds)
> where it felt like some of the advice was not defined (incidentally when
> the bug bit yesterday, C-h o still indicated the functions were
> adviced).

If it bites again, could you try and post (to the extent possible,
obviously) the function name, the output of (symbol-function
<thefunction>) along with as much as possible a concrete and detailed
description of an actual call's behavior on that function where we see
that the advice wasn't called?

> So wild conjecture:  Given make -j (the Makefile does impose some
> dependency order but not all)
> is it possible that things go south if something that is needed during
> the build of module-a.el gets byte-compiled *after* module-a.el?

In theory, no.  I (and many other people) build Emacs's `lisp` subdir in
parallel, and there are basically no dependencies in the makefile to try
and make sure files get compiled before they're used.  We've had some
corner case problems with it, but all the ones I know have been fixed.


        Stefan


> Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> writes:
>
>> IIUC after recompiling everything the problem disappeared.  If you
>> can't reproduce it any more, than I guess we can only close this
>> bug.
>>
>>> As an example, Module emacspeak-advice.el advices vc-next-action --- and
>>> this module (emacspeak-advice) is loaded early on during emacspeak
>>> initialization.
>>>
>>> When I later call vc-next-action during an emacs session and the
>>> autoload pulls in vc.el, the advice definition loaded earlier is not
>>> activated -- I have to explicitly reload module emacspeak-advice.
>>
>> In case you can still reproduce the problem, please show us what
>> `C-h o vc-next-action` tells you when you think it should have the
>> advice applied yet its behavior doesn't seem to be affected.
>>
>>
>>         Stefan
>>

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[T.V Raman via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors]

Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> writes:

I didn't mean the -j bit in building emacs, conjecture is that emacspeak
breaks if -j is used.


>> 4. As mentioned in this bug report at the outset I started seeing
>> strange behavior (that also appeared non-deterministic across builds)
>> where it felt like some of the advice was not defined (incidentally when
>> the bug bit yesterday, C-h o still indicated the functions were
>> adviced).
>
> If it bites again, could you try and post (to the extent possible,
> obviously) the function name, the output of (symbol-function
> <thefunction>) along with as much as possible a concrete and detailed
> description of an actual call's behavior on that function where we see
> that the advice wasn't called?
>
>> So wild conjecture:  Given make -j (the Makefile does impose some
>> dependency order but not all)
>> is it possible that things go south if something that is needed during
>> the build of module-a.el gets byte-compiled *after* module-a.el?
>
> In theory, no.  I (and many other people) build Emacs's `lisp` subdir in
> parallel, and there are basically no dependencies in the makefile to try
> and make sure files get compiled before they're used.  We've had some
> corner case problems with it, but all the ones I know have been fixed.
>
>
>         Stefan
>
>
>> Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> writes:
>>
>>> IIUC after recompiling everything the problem disappeared.  If you
>>> can't reproduce it any more, than I guess we can only close this
>>> bug.
>>>
>>>> As an example, Module emacspeak-advice.el advices vc-next-action --- and
>>>> this module (emacspeak-advice) is loaded early on during emacspeak
>>>> initialization.
>>>>
>>>> When I later call vc-next-action during an emacs session and the
>>>> autoload pulls in vc.el, the advice definition loaded earlier is not
>>>> activated -- I have to explicitly reload module emacspeak-advice.
>>>
>>> In case you can still reproduce the problem, please show us what
>>> `C-h o vc-next-action` tells you when you think it should have the
>>> advice applied yet its behavior doesn't seem to be affected.
>>>
>>>
>>>         Stefan
>>>
>

-- 

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Cc: 40688@debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Sun, 03 May 2020 07:16:04 -0700
> From: "T.V Raman" via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs,
>  the Swiss army knife of text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
> 
> is it possible that things go south if something that is needed during
> the build of module-a.el gets byte-compiled *after* module-a.el? 

It could happen if your dependencies in the Makefile are incomplete or
incorrect.

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[T.V Raman via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors]

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:

That's my guess ie something gets byte-compiled before a module it
depends on.>> Cc: 40688@debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Sun, 03 May 2020 07:16:04 -0700
>> From: "T.V Raman" via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs,
>>  the Swiss army knife of text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
>> 
>> is it possible that things go south if something that is needed during
>> the build of module-a.el gets byte-compiled *after* module-a.el? 
>
> It could happen if your dependencies in the Makefile are incomplete or
> incorrect.

-- 

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[Stefan Monnier]

> I didn't mean the -j bit in building emacs, conjecture is that emacspeak
> breaks if -j is used.

I was pointing out that Emacs's own use of `-j` to build the `lisp`
subdir indicates that it's OK to have missing dependencies on the `.elc`
files (and hence sometimes the .el file is loaded and sometimes the
`.elc`, depending on the compilation order; or even the `.el` file is
loaded while the corresponding `.elc` file is being generated).

Of course, if your `.el` files are generated by makefile rules that's
a completely different question.


        Stefan


>>> 4. As mentioned in this bug report at the outset I started seeing
>>> strange behavior (that also appeared non-deterministic across builds)
>>> where it felt like some of the advice was not defined (incidentally when
>>> the bug bit yesterday, C-h o still indicated the functions were
>>> adviced).
>>
>> If it bites again, could you try and post (to the extent possible,
>> obviously) the function name, the output of (symbol-function
>> <thefunction>) along with as much as possible a concrete and detailed
>> description of an actual call's behavior on that function where we see
>> that the advice wasn't called?
>>
>>> So wild conjecture:  Given make -j (the Makefile does impose some
>>> dependency order but not all)
>>> is it possible that things go south if something that is needed during
>>> the build of module-a.el gets byte-compiled *after* module-a.el?
>>
>> In theory, no.  I (and many other people) build Emacs's `lisp` subdir in
>> parallel, and there are basically no dependencies in the makefile to try
>> and make sure files get compiled before they're used.  We've had some
>> corner case problems with it, but all the ones I know have been fixed.
>>
>>
>>         Stefan
>>
>>
>>> Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> writes:
>>>
>>>> IIUC after recompiling everything the problem disappeared.  If you
>>>> can't reproduce it any more, than I guess we can only close this
>>>> bug.
>>>>
>>>>> As an example, Module emacspeak-advice.el advices vc-next-action --- and
>>>>> this module (emacspeak-advice) is loaded early on during emacspeak
>>>>> initialization.
>>>>>
>>>>> When I later call vc-next-action during an emacs session and the
>>>>> autoload pulls in vc.el, the advice definition loaded earlier is not
>>>>> activated -- I have to explicitly reload module emacspeak-advice.
>>>>
>>>> In case you can still reproduce the problem, please show us what
>>>> `C-h o vc-next-action` tells you when you think it should have the
>>>> advice applied yet its behavior doesn't seem to be affected.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>         Stefan
>>>>
>>

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[T.V Raman via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors]

Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> writes:

.el files are not generated by Makefile rules.

Again, conjecture: perhaps I'm hitting this because:

1. Emacspeak uses advice far more than emacs does?

 >> I didn't mean the -j bit in building emacs, conjecture is that emacspeak
>> breaks if -j is used.
>
> I was pointing out that Emacs's own use of `-j` to build the `lisp`
> subdir indicates that it's OK to have missing dependencies on the `.elc`
> files (and hence sometimes the .el file is loaded and sometimes the
> `.elc`, depending on the compilation order; or even the `.el` file is
> loaded while the corresponding `.elc` file is being generated).
>
> Of course, if your `.el` files are generated by makefile rules that's
> a completely different question.
>
>
>         Stefan
>
>
>>>> 4. As mentioned in this bug report at the outset I started seeing
>>>> strange behavior (that also appeared non-deterministic across builds)
>>>> where it felt like some of the advice was not defined (incidentally when
>>>> the bug bit yesterday, C-h o still indicated the functions were
>>>> adviced).
>>>
>>> If it bites again, could you try and post (to the extent possible,
>>> obviously) the function name, the output of (symbol-function
>>> <thefunction>) along with as much as possible a concrete and detailed
>>> description of an actual call's behavior on that function where we see
>>> that the advice wasn't called?
>>>
>>>> So wild conjecture:  Given make -j (the Makefile does impose some
>>>> dependency order but not all)
>>>> is it possible that things go south if something that is needed during
>>>> the build of module-a.el gets byte-compiled *after* module-a.el?
>>>
>>> In theory, no.  I (and many other people) build Emacs's `lisp` subdir in
>>> parallel, and there are basically no dependencies in the makefile to try
>>> and make sure files get compiled before they're used.  We've had some
>>> corner case problems with it, but all the ones I know have been fixed.
>>>
>>>
>>>         Stefan
>>>
>>>
>>>> Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> writes:
>>>>
>>>>> IIUC after recompiling everything the problem disappeared.  If you
>>>>> can't reproduce it any more, than I guess we can only close this
>>>>> bug.
>>>>>
>>>>>> As an example, Module emacspeak-advice.el advices vc-next-action --- and
>>>>>> this module (emacspeak-advice) is loaded early on during emacspeak
>>>>>> initialization.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When I later call vc-next-action during an emacs session and the
>>>>>> autoload pulls in vc.el, the advice definition loaded earlier is not
>>>>>> activated -- I have to explicitly reload module emacspeak-advice.
>>>>>
>>>>> In case you can still reproduce the problem, please show us what
>>>>> `C-h o vc-next-action` tells you when you think it should have the
>>>>> advice applied yet its behavior doesn't seem to be affected.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>         Stefan
>>>>>
>>>
>

-- 

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[Stefan Monnier]

> .el files are not generated by Makefile rules.
>
> Again, conjecture: perhaps I'm hitting this because:
>
> 1. Emacspeak uses advice far more than emacs does?

Could be.  Might be linked to the use `defadvice` (which has
a funny/broken behavior w.r.t macro expansion), but I can't think of
a good scenario where that would play a role.

Digging into the `symbol-function` value (and/or Edebugging) is the only
way I can imagine we will be able to track it down.


        Stefan


>  >> I didn't mean the -j bit in building emacs, conjecture is that emacspeak
>>> breaks if -j is used.
>>
>> I was pointing out that Emacs's own use of `-j` to build the `lisp`
>> subdir indicates that it's OK to have missing dependencies on the `.elc`
>> files (and hence sometimes the .el file is loaded and sometimes the
>> `.elc`, depending on the compilation order; or even the `.el` file is
>> loaded while the corresponding `.elc` file is being generated).
>>
>> Of course, if your `.el` files are generated by makefile rules that's
>> a completely different question.
>>
>>
>>         Stefan
>>
>>
>>>>> 4. As mentioned in this bug report at the outset I started seeing
>>>>> strange behavior (that also appeared non-deterministic across builds)
>>>>> where it felt like some of the advice was not defined (incidentally when
>>>>> the bug bit yesterday, C-h o still indicated the functions were
>>>>> adviced).
>>>>
>>>> If it bites again, could you try and post (to the extent possible,
>>>> obviously) the function name, the output of (symbol-function
>>>> <thefunction>) along with as much as possible a concrete and detailed
>>>> description of an actual call's behavior on that function where we see
>>>> that the advice wasn't called?
>>>>
>>>>> So wild conjecture:  Given make -j (the Makefile does impose some
>>>>> dependency order but not all)
>>>>> is it possible that things go south if something that is needed during
>>>>> the build of module-a.el gets byte-compiled *after* module-a.el?
>>>>
>>>> In theory, no.  I (and many other people) build Emacs's `lisp` subdir in
>>>> parallel, and there are basically no dependencies in the makefile to try
>>>> and make sure files get compiled before they're used.  We've had some
>>>> corner case problems with it, but all the ones I know have been fixed.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>         Stefan
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> writes:
>>>>>
>>>>>> IIUC after recompiling everything the problem disappeared.  If you
>>>>>> can't reproduce it any more, than I guess we can only close this
>>>>>> bug.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As an example, Module emacspeak-advice.el advices vc-next-action --- and
>>>>>>> this module (emacspeak-advice) is loaded early on during emacspeak
>>>>>>> initialization.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> When I later call vc-next-action during an emacs session and the
>>>>>>> autoload pulls in vc.el, the advice definition loaded earlier is not
>>>>>>> activated -- I have to explicitly reload module emacspeak-advice.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In case you can still reproduce the problem, please show us what
>>>>>> `C-h o vc-next-action` tells you when you think it should have the
>>>>>> advice applied yet its behavior doesn't seem to be affected.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>         Stefan
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[Glenn Morris]

Stefan Monnier wrote:

> I was pointing out that Emacs's own use of `-j` to build the `lisp`
> subdir indicates that it's OK to have missing dependencies on the `.elc`
> files (and hence sometimes the .el file is loaded and sometimes the
> `.elc`, depending on the compilation order; or even the `.el` file is
> loaded while the corresponding `.elc` file is being generated).

Emacs's build sets load-prefer-newer (IMO this should be the default,
but I expect this to be futile).

(But I have no idea what issue is being described in this report.)

bug#40688: 28.0.50; Advice And ByteCompile Behavior Change

[T.V Raman via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors]

That's a good tip, I can try that in the emacspeak build setup 
Glenn Morris writes:
 > Stefan Monnier wrote:
 > 
 > > I was pointing out that Emacs's own use of `-j` to build the `lisp`
 > > subdir indicates that it's OK to have missing dependencies on the `.elc`
 > > files (and hence sometimes the .el file is loaded and sometimes the
 > > `.elc`, depending on the compilation order; or even the `.el` file is
 > > loaded while the corresponding `.elc` file is being generated).
 > 
 > Emacs's build sets load-prefer-newer (IMO this should be the default,
 > but I expect this to be futile).
 > 
 > (But I have no idea what issue is being described in this report.)

-- 
Id: kg:/m/0285kf1 

-- 
Id: kg:/m/0285kf1