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Date: Thu, 08 Sep 2022 07:31:17 +0200 Message-ID: References: <8335dcu0sg.fsf@gnu.org> <83mtbks7mo.fsf@gnu.org> <837d2mqm98.fsf@gnu.org> <8335daqlsa.fsf@gnu.org> <83k06komhi.fsf@gnu.org> <83pmgcmmf1.fsf@gnu.org> <83leqvgib2.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="34040"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (darwin) Cc: Dmitrii Kuragin , 57434@debbugs.gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Sep 08 07:32:24 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oWA9I-0008k0-5g for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 08 Sep 2022 07:32:24 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:48236 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oWA9G-0006Em-Jq for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 08 Sep 2022 01:32:22 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:34180) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oWA8w-0006Bv-Ht for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 08 Sep 2022 01:32:02 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:40041) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oWA8w-0000Cv-8H for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 08 Sep 2022 01:32:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oWA8v-0001qC-UA for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 08 Sep 2022 01:32:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Gerd =?UTF-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Thu, 08 Sep 2022 05:32:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 57434 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: moreinfo Original-Received: via spool by 57434-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B57434.16626150877032 (code B ref 57434); Thu, 08 Sep 2022 05:32:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 57434) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Sep 2022 05:31:27 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56973 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oWA8N-0001pM-28 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 08 Sep 2022 01:31:27 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wm1-f42.google.com ([209.85.128.42]:46742) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1oWA8L-0001p8-UP for 57434@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 08 Sep 2022 01:31:26 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-wm1-f42.google.com with SMTP id k6-20020a05600c1c8600b003a54ecc62f6so892721wms.5 for <57434@debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 07 Sep 2022 22:31:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date; bh=6XxfiisyrPLG/sgRay44uuBkhMfLK7KGL33nH6VZvBE=; b=WwhVPOaotMlHq7wvl165d3i0aibgMHzlQC6Ix9z6tHFxxuxw9zGe1TMC4ztaCfxNDI rZgwx38Gj+TlvZIqJI23auktw4uEM39PEUcwN+8Cc8ejRWqJePzrDlJ2yJ+Ps41JIRm0 5THrvxIdiZtaoE8vR27IjCnll/mGlUYp+DPA21RecK9Q188m8gDcNhvFZXE7/U0RJDO2 haWoq8276nzS4+PkGFZd+1JkYFGS1W1I7PmqoUVYy21+c34ngJNVFIhncLwPysg347bT FgdnKCtd7U3z1QQbFMm7EtujTANqBDg4uCX0h1qDF98Nl1chNxBFvaIr3CrFzurY4DjC z3kA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date; bh=6XxfiisyrPLG/sgRay44uuBkhMfLK7KGL33nH6VZvBE=; b=zbUDxO96vBsFoutnmcuEAMqasdcLqZ1TYMQ+89w3nYcjGP+130K33YemQOCxTUm5n2 t2q74Jp7o8zF/5STQwwCo+fv2Y9vJfuODhQx89e1YYFSVjfIPt8S8UbyXqVMiFoGL0np 70xrhbA4j7DEXWusF5OfBYuPmjF+GxFpm0Dhbf3dVXnc8S6KqOzB3gD6vQ5s5RqgQPmn ESCw1/xYcGQ7PB56v8C2+SsjLKWT4GJ3IftkZMODDDjDZP6xEPIDUbnXfgZLQUuD9pLN 9mlZs7LR7FL6VROEaOSqd7bogw4miy0Ycuj5Vu8AWEXpvblpSJ3GfCmZ9SFJ+cPYQSp8 oyFg== X-Gm-Message-State: ACgBeo17tTSYVP4TYD/dbmzzeRRJmXychP1oE2qoUnRrrfmvaz5nC0/Q VEEULPkzQmSxbCvQiAD0raaACjM/wNswPA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AA6agR6T+e3VH5Q4YMRDQUO4NmVe6T3K47frzL+eLV098P0iwGqg3iUz+Zr2Bf5XCeN0xs4HidgITw== X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:3d11:b0:3a5:cd9b:eb08 with SMTP id bh17-20020a05600c3d1100b003a5cd9beb08mr974190wmb.82.1662615079670; Wed, 07 Sep 2022 22:31:19 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from Mini.fritz.box (pd9e367ac.dip0.t-ipconnect.de. [217.227.103.172]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id w14-20020adfd4ce000000b00228de351fc0sm7599668wrk.38.2022.09.07.22.31.18 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Wed, 07 Sep 2022 22:31:18 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <83leqvgib2.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Wed, 07 Sep 2022 21:17:53 +0300") X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:241820 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: Dmitrii Kuragin >> Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2022 09:11:32 -0700 >> Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 57434@debbugs.gnu.org >> >> Sorry I made you wait. I tried the patch (see attachments) and everything worked perfectly. No flickering. > > OK, thanks. > > So now the next question is: on what should we base the activation of > these hooks? There are several alternatives: > > . if alacritty produces a distinct value from tty-type, we could use > that, or > . if alacritty has a distinct terminfo capability that other > terminals don't, we could use that, or > . expose a variable to Lisp that users could set in order to turn > this on and off, and tell users to turn it on if they see the > issue > > Any other ideas? I'd like to emphasize that this is not a problem limited to Alacritty. There are a number of terminal emulators with GPU accelleration, which all share the same cpmceptual problem. Alacritty is just the one with the best marketing, riding the Rust wave. AFAICT, we have the following situation: - We have two proposals P1 and P2 (that we know of). Alacritty implements P1 only, says Dmitrii, and P2 has a table of emulators implementing P2, which may or may not implement P1. - Neither P1 nor P2 are detectable as a terminfo capability, so one has to match TERM or use a boolean switch. I don't know if all emulators use a discernable TERM, or if they use standard TERM names. > >> BTW, tmux uses the sync update for their own TUI and they check "Sync" terminal capability. Do we need to >> do the same or we can just send the escapes and hope the unsupported terminal would just recover? > > What is that Sync capability, what is its value for tmux, and how is > it supposed to be used? Is there any documentation I could read about > that? I know Sync as an xterm extension, although I don't remember what it is for. It's a non-standard terminfo capability which is only shown with infocmp -x. Neither P1 nor P2 mention Sync in any way.