From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#66706: [PATCH] Automatic elisp dialect insertion Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2023 07:48:19 -0400 Message-ID: References: <17C83052-7946-45DE-B660-DA7EB82001B0@gmail.com> <83sf61mb54.fsf@gnu.org> <98CD592C-0E82-4795-8168-2B5E597FF7A7@gmail.com> <8334xzlvy9.fsf@gnu.org> <87pm131pq6.fsf@yahoo.com> <87h6mf1k43.fsf@yahoo.com> Reply-To: Stefan Monnier Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="35685"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 66706@debbugs.gnu.org, Mattias =?UTF-8?Q?Engdeg=C3=A5rd?= , stefankangas@gmail.com To: Po Lu Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Oct 25 13:49:58 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qvcOb-0008z8-0Q for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; 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Wed, 25 Oct 2023 07:48:20 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from pastel (unknown [45.72.216.111]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 085D612044C; Wed, 25 Oct 2023 07:48:20 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: <87h6mf1k43.fsf@yahoo.com> (Po Lu's message of "Wed, 25 Oct 2023 11:01:00 +0800") X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:273156 Archived-At: >> But because having two dialects imposes an undue burden on our users. >> Those who read all the docs may not care, but all the others are >> vulnerable to the usual "I copied the code from that webpage and it >> doesn't work" because the code on that webpage used the other dialect. > I find this categorical dismissal of the intellectual or problem-solving > capacity, and perhaps fortitude if you will, of Emacs users very > patronizing, needless to say with my Emacs user hat on. There's no patronizing, here. Just experience. It *is* a source of confusion. I've seen enough such examples during my time in SX where people give a valid answer, followed by comments like: "doesn't work here" --Mr.Foo "I assumed you have lexical-binding enabled, try enabling it and see if it works" --Mr.Bar Sometimes the original poster tried to avoid the problem by including the `-*- lexical-binding:t -*-` cookie in his snippet, but the other user just copied that snippet to his existing file so the cookie didn't end up on the first line. I don't doubt that our users have the capacity to solve those problems. It's just that my sadism is already satisfied by all the other problems we foist on them. I myself get bitten by the different dialects every once in a while, sometimes even copying code within Emacs itself (typically taking a chunk of code from a buffer and running it inside `M-:` or `M-x ielm`). > Furthermore, it is quite dubitable that minor customizations of the > sort found on most web pages are suceptible to influence by the type > of variable binding used. And yet. Stefan