From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#2473: usability issues on emacs's describe-mode Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 23:34:21 -0500 Message-ID: References: Reply-To: Stefan Monnier , 2473@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1235796236 13310 80.91.229.12 (28 Feb 2009 04:43:56 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 04:43:56 +0000 (UTC) Cc: xah@xahlee.org, 2473@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com To: rms@gnu.org Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Feb 28 05:45:11 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1LdH4Y-0007aI-KG for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 28 Feb 2009 05:45:10 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50406 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LdH3D-0004uY-Pu for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 23:43:47 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LdH39-0004uJ-G4 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 23:43:43 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LdH36-0004u6-Vz for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 23:43:42 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=50711 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LdH36-0004u1-QO for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 23:43:40 -0500 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu ([138.23.92.77]:49768) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1LdH36-0005JC-7G for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 23:43:40 -0500 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu (rzlab.ucr.edu [127.0.0.1]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8/Debian-3) with ESMTP id n1S4hcQI016414; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 20:43:38 -0800 Original-Received: (from debbugs@localhost) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8/Submit) id n1S4e5tq015171; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 20:40:05 -0800 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Resent-From: Stefan Monnier Resent-To: bug-submit-list@donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 04:40:05 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 2473 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 2473-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B2473.123579567313234 (code B ref 2473); Sat, 28 Feb 2009 04:40:05 +0000 Original-Received: (at 2473) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 28 Feb 2009 04:34:33 +0000 X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. Original-Received: from ironport2-out.teksavvy.com (ironport2-out.teksavvy.com [206.248.154.182]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8/Debian-3) with ESMTP id n1S4YSWs013202 for <2473@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 20:34:30 -0800 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: ArIFAA9OqEnO+JhN/2dsb2JhbACBWdVNhBQGg2s X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,280,1233550800"; d="scan'208";a="34517757" Original-Received: from 206-248-152-77.dsl.teksavvy.com (HELO pastel.home) ([206.248.152.77]) by ironport2-out.teksavvy.com with ESMTP; 27 Feb 2009 23:34:23 -0500 Original-Received: by pastel.home (Postfix, from userid 20848) id DD06D9170; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 23:34:21 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: (Richard M. Stallman's message of "Fri, 27 Feb 2009 18:33:29 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.91 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 23:43:42 -0500 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:25823 Archived-At: > I see a 3rd way: make the buffer present an expandable list of modes, > starting with just 2 items: the current major modes and "minor modes", > e.g. similar to what we do in Speedbar, or maybe in Outline Mode > (under "Hide Sublevels"). In ASCII art: > + Major Mode: RMAIL Mode > + Minor Modes > Using hiding is a good idea -- thanks. > I think that partcular way would be inconvenient. Specifically, it > would be a hassle to initially hide the major mode documentation. > That is what users most often want to see; making them type a command > to expose it would be a gratuitous hassle. > So I suggest putting the partly-hidden minor mode list first, > followed by the totally visible major mode documentation. I don't think the difference with what we have now is worth the trouble. Basically, it's just a question of shortening the "list of minor modes" at the beginning of the buffer (e.g. by removing global minor modes from that list). Stefan