From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#67207: [PATCH] Add elixir-ts-mode-hook to elixir-ts-mode Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:39:30 -0500 Message-ID: References: <874jhmn9us.fsf@gmail.com> <835y22ren0.fsf@gnu.org> <8734x6rdvz.fsf@gmail.com> <834jhmrdpw.fsf@gnu.org> <87edgnzbj2.fsf@gmail.com> Reply-To: Stefan Monnier Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="6995"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Cc: Eli Zaretskii , 67207@debbugs.gnu.org To: Wilhelm Kirschbaum Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Nov 19 04:40:13 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1r4YfN-0001YH-81 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 19 Nov 2023 04:40:13 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r4YfC-0001Y0-Nl; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:40:02 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r4YfB-0001XL-Em for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:40:01 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:5::43]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1r4YfB-0000Hk-5W for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:40:01 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r4YfC-0006Pg-9W for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:40:02 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Stefan Monnier Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2023 03:40:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 67207 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch Original-Received: via spool by 67207-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B67207.170036518724613 (code B ref 67207); Sun, 19 Nov 2023 03:40:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 67207) by debbugs.gnu.org; 19 Nov 2023 03:39:47 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49713 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r4Yew-0006Ov-OI for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:39:47 -0500 Original-Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:50377) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1r4Yer-0006OY-QM for 67207@debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:39:44 -0500 Original-Received: from pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 201561000AD; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:39:35 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1700365170; bh=C640h0OyPqu5ciMnZEvqTsGAWR6IaeuS8McMD4i7Xik=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=KHa7z2FHJRFNRdPAhxC34u9VS/XfLXp0c3rDnN96DQyc+NHVqTXHq7xl+BvjE5eHp RyxBAjC3FLAFmGM120S1cAmZy71IXrLqncNSxs3A7U7qjhBjSZTkVAuNnpbNtyfcee 89x8CNrSvUvbQcIKOtQTMLp3YstC6y4dPw6u/tdbbuYG+RNhrGSe2/EfA7aH6oDpqG QJcKZENwkCU/q902yEImUqi/66IS7K1kiGMul71e+vKk6JMx7c2scZv5i2bsYT0Y7E i9UiO9tpRm8eqz73rAiVAswQJAVCFcSDp5OXvEDuFaL4U7ZWqWCHTM2Lf7cZKLbmAZ f4nFOpVBnippw== Original-Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 4C7E7100043; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:39:30 -0500 (EST) Original-Received: from pastel (unknown [45.72.227.120]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 245E9120488; Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:39:30 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: <87edgnzbj2.fsf@gmail.com> (Wilhelm Kirschbaum's message of "Sat, 18 Nov 2023 10:32:22 +0200") X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:274579 Archived-At: >>> Stefan, does this mean define-derived-mode has some deficiency? >>> Many/most modes defined using it don't have an explicit hook >>> definition, so should we now define a mode hook for all of them? >> Usually we don't have good ideas of `:options` to provide for hook >> variables, so it's not very useful to expose them to Custom. > After I had a look how it works, it seems pretty convenient for users > relying on customize menus and not knowing which hooks might be useful. > There are some modes using this feature, but its not consistently used. Yes but it's unreliable: as soon as some code uses `add-hook` on this hook variable, Custom gets all confused because it doesn't know why/where the variable has a different value from the one it expected. > Won't it make sense to define a hook to custom anyways, so that users > get used to the idea of using the customize menus to add hooks? As long as Custom breaks down when someone uses `add-hook`, I don't feel comfortable exposing unsuspecting users to the brittleness of hooks in Custom :-( Custom's main audience is specifically those users who don't (want to) know about such tricky interactions. > Only after using Emacs for 5+ years now I am only now discovering the > convenience of the customize menu, probably getting too lazy to update > init.el. :-) Stefan