From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#21709: 25.0.50; doc of :variable in `define-minor-mode' Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2015 10:52:10 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: References: <131df705-9c27-4cb5-940e-755ea2635031@default> <87si567qk1.fsf@fastmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1445277204 18713 80.91.229.3 (19 Oct 2015 17:53:24 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2015 17:53:24 +0000 (UTC) To: Random832 , 21709@debbugs.gnu.org Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Oct 19 19:53:11 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoEcQ-0008DM-OE for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 19 Oct 2015 19:53:10 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:41353 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoEcQ-0003Yi-Ak for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 19 Oct 2015 13:53:10 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:44726) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoEcM-0003VZ-0x for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 19 Oct 2015 13:53:06 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoEcI-0008Nz-Rg for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 19 Oct 2015 13:53:05 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.43]:38090) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoEcI-0008Nt-MN for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 19 Oct 2015 13:53:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoEcI-000052-AP for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 19 Oct 2015 13:53:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Drew Adams Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2015 17:53:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 21709 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 21709-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B21709.144527713732698 (code B ref 21709); Mon, 19 Oct 2015 17:53:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 21709) by debbugs.gnu.org; 19 Oct 2015 17:52:17 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57028 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoEbY-0008VJ-Ko for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 19 Oct 2015 13:52:16 -0400 Original-Received: from aserp1040.oracle.com ([141.146.126.69]:49878) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoEbW-0008VB-95 for 21709@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 19 Oct 2015 13:52:14 -0400 Original-Received: from userv0022.oracle.com (userv0022.oracle.com [156.151.31.74]) by aserp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id t9JHqCox012304 (version=TLSv1 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 19 Oct 2015 17:52:13 GMT Original-Received: from aserv0122.oracle.com (aserv0122.oracle.com [141.146.126.236]) by userv0022.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t9JHqC4P011370 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 Oct 2015 17:52:12 GMT Original-Received: from abhmp0019.oracle.com (abhmp0019.oracle.com [141.146.116.25]) by aserv0122.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t9JHqBjL030158; Mon, 19 Oct 2015 17:52:11 GMT In-Reply-To: <87si567qk1.fsf@fastmail.com> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9 (901082) [OL 12.0.6691.5000 (x86)] X-Source-IP: userv0022.oracle.com [156.151.31.74] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 208.118.235.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:107767 Archived-At: > A state could be a single variable, it could be a dozen variables, it > could be a file on the disk [which GET reads and SET writes] - the point > is to have an abstraction that doesn't care what it is. OK; right. In that case there is still no reason to speak of a "state". In that case, the GET sexp can do *anything* and so can the SET function. > Seems like what it really is is a "hackish" way to define a generalized > variable without actually defining one. A sort of "generalized variable > lambda" except for the fact that setf doesn't actually support it. Yup, and not made clear by the doc. (FWIW, grepping the Emacs Lisp sources, it seems that a non-variable PLACE is used only a few times.) And perhaps this should be mentioned in the doc: Using :variable prevents `d-m-m' from defining the variable again, if it was already defined by C code. This idiom is used several times in the Emacs Lisp source code. E.g.: (define-minor-mode abbrev-mode "..." :variable abbrev-mode)