From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#14802: 24.3.50; (elisp) Multiple Terminals - what is a terminal attribute? Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 11:27:58 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: References: <> <<8361onuej0.fsf@gnu.org>> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1392060587 11891 80.91.229.3 (10 Feb 2014 19:29:47 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 19:29:47 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 14802@debbugs.gnu.org, larsi@gnus.org To: Eli Zaretskii , Drew Adams Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Feb 10 20:29:50 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1WCwYA-0007Xm-3D for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 20:29:50 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:57787 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WCwY9-0005w1-Lr for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 14:29:49 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:39879) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WCwXX-0005K5-OW for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 14:29:20 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WCwXO-0004j4-WC for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 14:29:11 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:33901) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WCwXO-0004j0-O5 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 14:29:02 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WCwXO-0003kD-I9 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 14:29:02 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Drew Adams Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 19:29:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 14802 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 14802-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B14802.139206049114328 (code B ref 14802); Mon, 10 Feb 2014 19:29:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 14802) by debbugs.gnu.org; 10 Feb 2014 19:28:11 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41796 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WCwWY-0003j1-Rd for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 14:28:11 -0500 Original-Received: from userp1040.oracle.com ([156.151.31.81]:21641) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1WCwWV-0003im-NF for 14802@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 14:28:08 -0500 Original-Received: from acsinet22.oracle.com (acsinet22.oracle.com [141.146.126.238]) by userp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id s1AJS0EP024708 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 10 Feb 2014 19:28:01 GMT Original-Received: from userz7021.oracle.com (userz7021.oracle.com [156.151.31.85]) by acsinet22.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s1AJRxSD001824 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 10 Feb 2014 19:28:00 GMT Original-Received: from abhmp0015.oracle.com (abhmp0015.oracle.com [141.146.116.21]) by userz7021.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s1AJRx19028341; Mon, 10 Feb 2014 19:27:59 GMT In-Reply-To: <<8361onuej0.fsf@gnu.org>> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.8 (707110) [OL 12.0.6680.5000 (x86)] X-Source-IP: acsinet22.oracle.com [141.146.126.238] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:85309 Archived-At: > I really don't understand the purpose of this bug report, because > this very node is the answer to all your questions and gripes. It > includes: >=20 > . a full list of the attributes of a terminal object (directly > below the single sentence you cited in your report) > . documentation of functions that access those attributes, and > . references to other nodes where related features and issues are > described So you _are_ saying that "terminal attribute" is a term and concept being introduced, and we are not just using the English word "attribute" in a general sense. Great. In that case, please put it in quotes, as we usually do for a term introduction. And, as this bug report requests, say something about what it is, if you can - what the term means. Listing values is not really a substitute for that. > What else is missing? See above. > > If what is meant really is something technical that is known > > as a terminal attribute (as one user, I really don't know), > > then that term either needs explaining or users should be > > sent elsewhere for info about it. >=20 > I see nothing wrong with the word "attribute". In this very manual, > we have: >=20 > . text attributes > . face attributes > . file attributes > . package attributes > . process attributes >=20 > What's wrong with having "terminal object attributes"? Nothing. Say what you mean by the term, as we do for each of the others you cited. And index it. Compare what you see by following `i face attribute': The term is quoted and described: "Face attributes" determine the visual appearance of a face... Or follow `i package attribute', to see: Each package (whether simple or multi-file) has certain "attributes": (That one is a minimal description - it just introduces particular attributes without saying what is meant by the term. But at least it introduces the term explicitly.) BTW, "attributes of text" is in the index, but "text attribute" should also be added. And the indexed node is `Text Properties'. The term "text attribute" should be cited there as meaning the same as "text property", which is the term described. Also, I said "each" above, but that's not quite right: * The term "file attribute" also should be introduced explicitly, in node `File Attributes'. E.g.: ...detailed information about a file, including the owner and group numbers, the number of names, the inode number, the size, and the times of access and modification. Add something like this: `These characteristics are referred to as "file attributes".' * "Process attribute" is also not introduced explicitly, in node `System Processes'. Also, although function `process-attributes' is indexed, `process attribute' is not.